Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2009/01/18
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]On Jan 18, 2009, at 6:56 AM, Seth Rosner wrote: > Charlie, Frank and other vinyl-o-philes - say it quickly and it will > sound like vanillafiles ;-) : > > a few years ago a dear friend and client of over 30 years passed and > left me her almost entirely classical record collection, probably > over 2,000 discs, 78 and 33. Onto that I also have discs from the > 1930's and 40's I inherited from my parents, who met as a result of > having the same voice teacher. I intend to engage a music major at > Skidmore College, here in Saratoga Springs, to catalog them. Is > there a company through which I may sell what I don't want to keep? let me add a question here please, with a small change in the subject header... I have many ! selected mint classical/jazz/french CD's...how & where best to sell them? thanks, Steve > > > Seth > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charlie Chan" > <topoxforddoc@btinternet.com > > > To: "Leica Users Group" <lug@leica-users.org> > Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2009 7:37 AM > Subject: Re: [Leica] more audiophilia spectacularly OT but > interesting to a few > > >> There's no substitute for using your senses - eyes or ears. Good >> dealers are difficult to come by nowadays. Two channel hi-fi is much >> more of a niche market now, with many people going to 5.1 or 7.1 >> systems with lots of bass boost. >> >> I've collected my hi-fi over 30 years, having spent my younger days >> selling the stuff in a shop with a guy called Ken Kessler. As a >> result, I'm a vinyl, valves (tubes) and efficient speakers man. >> there's no such thing as a perfect hi-fi component or system. The >> room >> in which you listen is very important too; you just have to go to >> enough live music events (classical, jazz or rock) to appreciate how >> some venues are acoustically terrible. >> >> I've spent a lot of money on my turntable (Platine Verdier/ Schroeder >> Model 2 arm and Allaerts MC1B cartridge) and I'm very happy now. So >> now I just spend my money on records. It's just like cameras - you >> buy >> the kit you want to use and then you should take lots of pictures. >> >> Charlie Chan >> Cheltenham, UK >> >> On 18 Jan 2009, at 08:48, Frank Dernie wrote: >> >>> Lluis, >>> I learned this lesson years ago, like you. I also had a dealer, now >>> retired, who let me try anything at home. Most of what I use now I >>> bought from him over the years, the most recent about 10 years ago, >>> based on listening. I am still very happy! >>> 20 years after having been so impressed by how much less parasitic >>> interference there was on the pickup signal using a Goldmund >>> reference turntable I managed to track down a used one in good >>> mechanical condition at a not too extreme price. That is what I now >>> use. >>> best regards, >>> Frank >>> >>> On 17 Jan, 2009, at 18:48, Lluis Ripoll wrote: >>> >>>> Hi Frank, >>>> >>>> Thank you for your good explanation, you have a really good >>>> knowledge, the problem with the Hi-Fi is as you know that the >>>> prices to improve quality increase geometrically, in other words, >>>> if your actual investiment is level 10 to have a quality level 15 >>>> you should pay 20, and to have a quality 23 you should pay 35... In >>>> my experience when I've purchased something I've paid attention to >>>> the differences etc.., even the shop who sells me they know me >>>> after I was very young and they leave me the things at home to try >>>> and compare..., but once you buy it you are used to listen and >>>> many, many times I don't pay attention to the details that make >>>> better an outfit over the other. >>>> >>>> Saludos cordiales >>>> Lluis >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> El 17/01/2009, a las 19:03, Frank Dernie escribi?: >>>> >>>>> Hi Lluis! >>>>> Before I took up my current career I did R&D and design of record >>>>> players. You are absolutely right, the requirement of the >>>>> turntable is to rotate at constant speed and no sound parasites. >>>>> The technical problem is to achieve this. No turntable I have ever >>>>> measured or heard actually achieves it. Our ears are more >>>>> sensitive than any transducer in both frequency and amplitude. >>>>> There is -no- turntable ever made which produces no sound >>>>> parasites, and the vast majority produce a lot of sound parasites >>>>> and at quite high level. Clever designers design their players so >>>>> the parasitic resonances and feedback are at frequencies and "Q" >>>>> that listeners find pleasant. Many record players I have measured >>>>> have very obviously been tuned to only add harmonious >>>>> "interference". >>>>> There was one very highly regarded SME arm, the 3009, which had >>>>> such energetic resonances that they could be seen as big peaks on >>>>> the curve if one was trying to measure a pickup cartridge, the >>>>> signal added by this arm at some frequencies was louder than the >>>>> original music! The other thing difficult to avoid is the time >>>>> delayed feedback from the sound in the room, both structure-borne >>>>> and airborne. >>>>> >>>>> A few people have tried to lower there parasitics considerably. >>>>> The ones I have seen which do this in a technically sound way are >>>>> Goldmund and Continuum (there are others who get part way there at >>>>> a less "no compromise price"). I am familiar with the Goldmund >>>>> (the original not the new limited edition one which seems >>>>> ludicrously expensive) Of all those I know it allows by far the >>>>> lowest level of parasitic interference get to the pickup >>>>> cartridge. What Continuum print is technically very sound. I would >>>>> not be surprised to find it superior to the Goldmund in these >>>>> respects. >>>>> >>>>> The Clearaudio is based on pseudo-technical gobbledygook which is >>>>> either there to keep their secrets or, looking at the design, >>>>> simply to separate clients from their cash. In my opinion. >>>>> >>>>> The pickup cartridge is, as you say, very important. I also use an >>>>> Ortofon. In fact the generator design and pivot damping dominate >>>>> the characteristics at lower frequencies. As frequencies increase >>>>> the shape of the stylus tip is increasingly important, I forget >>>>> the frequency limit for the original spherical tips but at a >>>>> surprisingly low frequency the radius of the tip is bigger than >>>>> the curve it would have to follow in the groove. At this point it >>>>> starts being very inaccurate. The best stylus tips are very >>>>> expensive. All this is wasted however if the turntable and arm >>>>> either generate parasites or allow feedback through. All >>>>> turntables do to a surprisingly high degree, the nice ones are the >>>>> ones that add harmonious interference! >>>>> >>>>> best regards, >>>>> >>>>> Frank >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 17 Jan, 2009, at 16:26, Lluis Ripoll wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Frank, >>>>>> >>>>>> This is a beautiful "toy"! >>>>>> >>>>>> In my opinion the turntable is not a "main element", the capsule >>>>>> could be more important. For me the work of a turntable should >>>>>> be: constant speed, and no sound parasites, the good work is do >>>>>> by the rest of the installation and also a vey important thing, >>>>>> I've expend some money on have good cables and connectors. My >>>>>> turntable is a Lenco L-78 from the 70's with an Ortophon capsule >>>>>> and it still sound very good, enought for me. >>>>>> >>>>>> Saludos cordiales >>>>>> Lluis >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> El 17/01/2009, a las 11:32, Frank Dernie escribi?: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I know most of you will think this high price stuff is a joke, >>>>>>> and at this price (and actually, looking at the design as a >>>>>>> person who used to design high end turntables >30 years ago, >>>>>>> this particular item is a victory for marketing). The most >>>>>>> important engineering aspects for a turntable to work well are >>>>>>> not addressed in this design, more a styling/marketing exercise >>>>>>> (IMHO). >>>>>>> It is actually extremely high tech to produce a device to >>>>>>> transduce records without adding some, or a lot, of non signal >>>>>>> related vibrations ends up being added to the output by the >>>>>>> machine. A record playing device which works well is likely to >>>>>>> cost several orders on magnitude more than any CD player, and >>>>>>> is probably not worth it........ >>>>>>> The device I have measured and listened to which is the most >>>>>>> accurate, the Goldmund Reference was very expensive (not as much >>>>>>> as this thing though) and made in tiny quantities. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There is a very expensive turntable system which, based on my >>>>>>> knowledge, probably is the most accurate one available. It >>>>>>> cleverly addresses all the important requirements I know of. I >>>>>>> have never seen or listened to one. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.continuumaudiolabs.com/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> but not as pretty. >>>>>>> FWIW, >>>>>>> Frank >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 16 Jan, 2009, at 20:17, Henning Wulff wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> At 12:26 PM -0700 1/16/09, Greg Lorenzo wrote: >>>>>>>>> George Lottermoser writes:> > >>>>>>>>> <http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/01/16/ces.luxury.turntable/index.html? >>>>>>>>> > iref=mpstoryview>> > nonsensically cryptic,> george >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Quoted from the link: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> "When I look at it," said Placido Pappalardo, co-owner of >>>>>>>>> maker Angelis Labor, "the only word that comes to mind is >>>>>>>>> love." >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The first word that came to my mind was 'stupid'. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Greg Lorenzo >>>>>>>>> Calgary, Canada >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> How about this one for $125,000? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.musicalsurroundings.com/clearaudio/CAstatement.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> But the tonearms are included. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> * Henning J. Wulff >>>>>>>> /|\ Wulff Photography & Design >>>>>>>> /###\ mailto:henningw@archiphoto.com >>>>>>>> |[ ]| http://www.archiphoto.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Leica Users Group. >>>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >>>>>>>> information >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Leica Users Group. >>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >>>>>>> information >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Leica Users Group. >>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >>>>>> information >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Leica Users Group. >>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >>>>> information >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Leica Users Group. >>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >>>> information >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Leica Users Group. >>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Leica Users Group. >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.8/1898 - Release Date: > 1/16/2009 3:09 PM > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information