Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2009/01/17
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]Hi Lluis! Before I took up my current career I did R&D and design of record players. You are absolutely right, the requirement of the turntable is to rotate at constant speed and no sound parasites. The technical problem is to achieve this. No turntable I have ever measured or heard actually achieves it. Our ears are more sensitive than any transducer in both frequency and amplitude. There is -no- turntable ever made which produces no sound parasites, and the vast majority produce a lot of sound parasites and at quite high level. Clever designers design their players so the parasitic resonances and feedback are at frequencies and "Q" that listeners find pleasant. Many record players I have measured have very obviously been tuned to only add harmonious "interference". There was one very highly regarded SME arm, the 3009, which had such energetic resonances that they could be seen as big peaks on the curve if one was trying to measure a pickup cartridge, the signal added by this arm at some frequencies was louder than the original music! The other thing difficult to avoid is the time delayed feedback from the sound in the room, both structure-borne and airborne. A few people have tried to lower there parasitics considerably. The ones I have seen which do this in a technically sound way are Goldmund and Continuum (there are others who get part way there at a less "no compromise price"). I am familiar with the Goldmund (the original not the new limited edition one which seems ludicrously expensive) Of all those I know it allows by far the lowest level of parasitic interference get to the pickup cartridge. What Continuum print is technically very sound. I would not be surprised to find it superior to the Goldmund in these respects. The Clearaudio is based on pseudo-technical gobbledygook which is either there to keep their secrets or, looking at the design, simply to separate clients from their cash. In my opinion. The pickup cartridge is, as you say, very important. I also use an Ortofon. In fact the generator design and pivot damping dominate the characteristics at lower frequencies. As frequencies increase the shape of the stylus tip is increasingly important, I forget the frequency limit for the original spherical tips but at a surprisingly low frequency the radius of the tip is bigger than the curve it would have to follow in the groove. At this point it starts being very inaccurate. The best stylus tips are very expensive. All this is wasted however if the turntable and arm either generate parasites or allow feedback through. All turntables do to a surprisingly high degree, the nice ones are the ones that add harmonious interference! best regards, Frank On 17 Jan, 2009, at 16:26, Lluis Ripoll wrote: > Frank, > > This is a beautiful "toy"! > > In my opinion the turntable is not a "main element", the capsule > could be more important. For me the work of a turntable should be: > constant speed, and no sound parasites, the good work is do by the > rest of the installation and also a vey important thing, I've expend > some money on have good cables and connectors. My turntable is a > Lenco L-78 from the 70's with an Ortophon capsule and it still sound > very good, enought for me. > > Saludos cordiales > Lluis > > > El 17/01/2009, a las 11:32, Frank Dernie escribi?: > >> I know most of you will think this high price stuff is a joke, and >> at this price (and actually, looking at the design as a person who >> used to design high end turntables >30 years ago, this particular >> item is a victory for marketing). The most important engineering >> aspects for a turntable to work well are not addressed in this >> design, more a styling/marketing exercise (IMHO). >> It is actually extremely high tech to produce a device to transduce >> records without adding some, or a lot, of non signal related >> vibrations ends up being added to the output by the machine. A >> record playing device which works well is likely to cost several >> orders on magnitude more than any CD player, and is probably not >> worth it........ >> The device I have measured and listened to which is the most >> accurate, the Goldmund Reference was very expensive (not as much as >> this thing though) and made in tiny quantities. >> >> There is a very expensive turntable system which, based on my >> knowledge, probably is the most accurate one available. It cleverly >> addresses all the important requirements I know of. I have never >> seen or listened to one. >> >> http://www.continuumaudiolabs.com/ >> >> but not as pretty. >> FWIW, >> Frank >> >> >> On 16 Jan, 2009, at 20:17, Henning Wulff wrote: >> >>> At 12:26 PM -0700 1/16/09, Greg Lorenzo wrote: >>>> George Lottermoser writes:> > >>>> <http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/01/16/ces.luxury.turntable/index.html? >>>> > iref=mpstoryview>> > nonsensically cryptic,> george >>>> >>>> Quoted from the link: >>>> >>>> "When I look at it," said Placido Pappalardo, co-owner of maker >>>> Angelis Labor, "the only word that comes to mind is love." >>>> >>>> The first word that came to my mind was 'stupid'. >>>> >>>> Greg Lorenzo >>>> Calgary, Canada >>> >>> >>> >>> How about this one for $125,000? >>> >>> >>> http://www.musicalsurroundings.com/clearaudio/CAstatement.html >>> >>> >>> But the tonearms are included. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> * Henning J. Wulff >>> /|\ Wulff Photography & Design >>> /###\ mailto:henningw@archiphoto.com >>> |[ ]| http://www.archiphoto.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Leica Users Group. >>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Leica Users Group. >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information