Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2006/11/01

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Subject: [Leica] M8 & Depth of Field
From: photo.forrest at earthlink.net (Philip Forrest)
Date: Wed Nov 1 12:40:59 2006

Yeah, in the end, it's all semantics.  What matters is the light on the film
plane.

-----Original Message-----
From: lug-bounces+photo.forrest=earthlink.net@leica-users.org
[mailto:lug-bounces+photo.forrest=earthlink.net@leica-users.org] On Behalf
Of Walt Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 3:38 PM
To: Leica Users Group
Subject: Re: [Leica] M8 & Depth of Field

Could we call it normal on an APS?  Better yet can we say who 
cares....Lets see more of Rivera's subject matter :-)

Philip Forrest wrote:

>We did say that, but the depth of field markings on the lens will still be
>valid.  
>I just don't like people calling a 35mm lens on an APS sized digital, a 45
>or 50mm lens.  Because it's not.  
>We don't call our 160mm lenses for our 4x5's 50mm lenses, do we?  The same
>with 6x6.  My normal is an 80mm.  It has a very similar field of view as a
>50 on 35mm format, but I still call it an 80mm.  
>So, we've changed format sizes by going to the less-than-full-frame
>digitals.  
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: lug-bounces+photo.forrest=earthlink.net@leica-users.org
>[mailto:lug-bounces+photo.forrest=earthlink.net@leica-users.org] On Behalf
>Of Walt Johnson
>Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 3:22 PM
>To: Leica Users Group
>Subject: Re: [Leica] M8 & Depth of Field
>
>So in other words a normal lens on a 35 will be a wide angle on a 2 1/4. 
>I though that's what we said to begin with? Could I get by saying I'm 
>changing my lenses now. I want more coverage so off with the 50 and on 
>with the 28. :-D  Philip, I know you are absolutely right in what you're 
>saying. In the  real world the 50mm should fake being a 65 on an M8 though?
>
>Philip Forrest wrote:
>
>  
>
>>The angle of view is different, but everything else about the image is
>>exactly the same.  If you use a 47mm large format lens on a 35mm or a 6x6
>>    
>>
>or
>  
>
>>a 4x5 the results will be exactly the same on the film plane.  The big
>>difference between a 6x6 50mm lens and the same focal length for a 35mm
>>camera is lens coverage.  All that said, the lens will always have the
same
>>depth of field regardless of format.  Leica lenses don't know whether they
>>are on Leicas or Epsons or Deardorffs or oatmeal boxes.  The lens doesn't
>>know & doesn't care.  It does one thing, project an image onto a plane.
>>    
>>
>The
>  
>
>>best way to discern this difference is to shoot the same focal length lens
>>with several different formats, then look at the negatives, not
>>enlargements.  OR make prints that keep the difference of format apparent.
>>Ie: shoot one scene with three different cameras all with 75mm lenses then
>>make prints at a 3x enlargement for all of them.  Then cut out the center
>>    
>>
>of
>  
>
>>the largest prints to match the size of the smallest ones.  They will be
>>exactly the same.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: lug-bounces+photo.forrest=earthlink.net@leica-users.org
>>[mailto:lug-bounces+photo.forrest=earthlink.net@leica-users.org] On Behalf
>>Of Walt Johnson
>>Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 12:13 PM
>>To: Leica Users Group
>>Subject: Re: [Leica] M8 & Depth of Field
>>
>>Put a 55 on a 6x6 and compare it with what you get with a 55 on a 35mm.
>>
>>Raimo K wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>>>A 50 is a 50 mm - always (nominally). It does not become a 65 or 
>>>anything else.
>>>All the best!
>>>Raimo K
>>>Personal photography homepage at:
>>>http://www.uusikaupunki.fi/~raikorho
>>>
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Walt Johnson" <walt@waltjohnson.com>
>>>To: "Leica Users Group" <lug@leica-users.org>
>>>Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 2:47 AM
>>>Subject: Re: [Leica] M8 & Depth of Field
>>>
>>>
>>>   
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Luis, I'm not sure I can buy into Jim's statement. a 50 on a 35mm is 
>>>>close to normal (46 mm is closer) if it becomes a 65 wouldn't that 
>>>>change the effective depth of field? Where is that genius Marc when 
>>>>we need him?
>>>>
>>>>Luis Ripoll wrote:
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>Thanks for clarify Jim,
>>>>>
>>>>>Saludos cordiales,
>>>>>Luis
>>>>>
>>>>>-----Mensaje original-----
>>>>>De: lug-bounces+luisripoll=telefonica.net@leica-users.org
>>>>>[mailto:lug-bounces+luisripoll=telefonica.net@leica-users.org] En 
>>>>>nombre de
>>>>>Digiratidoc@aol.com
>>>>>Enviado el: mi?rcoles, 01 de noviembre de 2006 0:16
>>>>>Para: lug@leica-users.org
>>>>>Asunto: Re: [Leica] M8 & Depth of Field
>>>>>
>>>>>Depth of field would not change. It's still a 50mm lens but the 
>>>>>image is cropped.
>>>>>Jim
>>>>>In a message dated 10/31/2006 4:42:02 P.M. Central Standard Time, 
>>>>>luisripoll@telefonica.net writes:
>>>>>Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>>On the M8 lenses become  1,3x, would this affect the depth of 
>>>>>field?, on
>>>>>other words, will have a lens  the same depth of field and at the same
>>>>>distance, on a M8 or an M?, maybe is  an stupid question, but if a 
>>>>>50 is any
>>>>>more a 50 on a M8, and it becomes a  65, I think the depth of field 
>>>>>will
>>>>>proportionally decrease, on this case I  suppose too that actual scales
>>>>>based
>>>>>on 35mm format will be no more valid for  1,3 format.
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks for your comments,
>>>>>
>>>>>Saludos desde  Barcelona
>>>>>Luis
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Leica Users  Group.
>>>>>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more  information
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Leica Users Group.
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Leica Users Group.
>>>>>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Leica Users Group.
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>>>>     
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Leica Users Group.
>>>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>
>>>   
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
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>>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Leica Users Group.
>>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>
>> 
>>
>>    
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Leica Users Group.
>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Leica Users Group.
>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>
>  
>

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In reply to: Message from walt at waltjohnson.com (Walt Johnson) ([Leica] M8 & Depth of Field)