Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2013/06/26

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Subject: [Leica] Buying Leica.....
From: hopsternew at (Geoff Hopkinson)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 09:27:55 +1000
References: <> <> <ECBCDC0FB09C4B3A8759BFEC2A31B8E8@jimnichols>

All of those film Leicas are unchanged by the availability of digital
though. They still work the same.
Which digital cameras of any brand at any price are the equal of the best
mechanical bodies from anyone in that " life time service"aspect?. They are
different by definition.
The R system is dead and was announced so almost 4 years ago to the day. I
was there.  I honestly think that there is nothing useful served now by
nostalgia for that system.
The new M from my initial impressions is no R10 either. It is a functional
vehicle for those lenses as are the various adapters and modifications to
other systems. If I owned some of the very best of the R lenses, I would
try to make them work on the M of course. Actually I plan to try for the
exercise in cooperation with Leica here and a fellow LUG man with those
wonderful big lenses.

Otherwise dedicated dSLR systems seem to me to just be the best choice
(unless I could justify the S System but very very few of us can).

I don't know, I just checked and I have made more than 18,000 photos with
my M8 and M9 combined. They just worked without fault and the M9 still
does. My M8 is somewhere out there in the world, I have no clue.

My entirely mechanical high end M lenses make wonderful photographs if I do
my part but two of the best have required adjustment, one twice since I
used it and handled it enough over five years of so to put it out of spec

*Dear Ex-Prime Minister and colleagues........Cowards!*


On 27 June 2013 09:06, Jim Nichols <jhnichols at> wrote:

> Hi George,
> You see things much the way that I do.  I bought my first Leica body and
> lens in 1952, probably much earlier than most on this list.  Though the
> IIIa was made in 1935, it had been serviced and had a new shutter when I
> got it. Though it definitely needs a CLA, it will make images, reliably, to
> this day.  That is what started my appreciation of Leica products.
> Their digital products seem to be built for a limited lifetime.  The two
> lines are entirely different, as I see them.  I have a difficult time
> "buying into" their current approach to digital camera bodies.
> Jim Nichols
> Tullahoma, TN USA
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Lottermoser" <imagist3 at 
> To: "Leica Users Group" <lug at>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 5:55 PM
> Subject: Re: [Leica] Buying Leica.....
>> On Jun 26, 2013, at 5:25 PM, John McMaster wrote:
>>  With hindsight I would still go Leica, nothing to touch the lenses for
>>> different looks and I prefer the simpler operation, but if I had not used
>>> them what would make me spend 'rather a lot' more on Leica than Fuji? 
>>> Does
>>> 'full frame' or the build quality make enough of a difference for the 
>>> price
>>> jump to most people?
>> The piece of this "to Leica or not to Leica" quandary that throws me
>> is the relatively recent "lack of reliability and maintenance."
>> For over 30 years I KNEW that my Leicas would stand up to daily use;
>> be able to be CLA'd and maintained for the duration of my life.
>> When the digital R path ended abruptly - doubt set in.
>> Recent stories of lack of parts or repair paths for 5 year old cameras
>> seems totally unacceptable for "any" camera company;
>> let alone a high end, premium camera company.
>> I expected that, what ever its flaws may be, that I could keep my M8
>> making photographs for as long as I chose to hang on to it;
>> just like every other Leica camera that came before it.
>> The idea that $7K camera bodies are simply disposable hardware
>> with a useable life of a two year warranty - feels totally unacceptable
>> to me.
>> If not unacceptable - certainly unaffordable - to me.
>> I'm coming from that place where the 50 year old Linhof Tech IV
>> I just sold works every bit as well the day I handed it to Forrest
>> as the day it left the factory.
>> This whole new device, whether computer, camera body, phone
>> whatever - simply feels quite "wrong."
>> I welcome technological advances and their concomitant costs;
>> while also expecting that if I choose to remain a couple generations back;
>> that high priced hardware continue to perform somewhere close to specs;
>> and be designed for adjustment back to original specs.
>> Regards,
>> George Lottermoser
>> george at
>>**imagist <>
>> ______________________________**_________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See 
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