Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2010/04/03

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Subject: [Leica] widest lens used?
From: s.dimitrov at charter.net (slobodan Dimitrov)
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 2010 15:11:52 -0700
References: <C7DC4D71.60A12%mark@rabinergroup.com> <p06230907c7dd2deee5e7@192.168.1.5> <8D50B6EA-3D52-481D-8AED-A246AB3DFEDD@charter.net> <t2oeb6799211004031328k7afc2a46y41b4ab70c9ebb65a@mail.gmail.com>

I sold mine a long time ago, along with my other M series bodies and lenses. 
I still have a LTM kit, 2 bodies, 4 lenses. I could use 3 more lenses! Such 
as a 15mm, 28mm, and 135mm. I still use the LTM because they are harder to 
use, requiring more care and concentration.
S.d.

On Apr 3, 2010, at 1:28 PM, Richard Man wrote:

> I thoguth you have the SA? Why bother with the CV then?
> 
> 
> On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 12:22 PM, slobodan Dimitrov
> <s.dimitrov at charter.net>wrote:
> 
>> The main thing that makes my 21mm C/V loiter in the camera bag, is that it
>> has a look reminiscent of 60-70's Nikon glass. It's a bit brittle in the 
>> mid
>> range.
>> Can the lens be re-centered aftermarket?
>> S.d.
>> 
>> 
>> On Apr 3, 2010, at 10:52 AM, Henning Wulff wrote:
>> 
>>> Some years ago I did a comparison for the LHSA Viewfinder of four 21mm
>> lenses: the CV 21/4, Ricoh 21/3.5, SA f/3.4 and Elmarit ASPH f/2.8. I used
>> to have the older Elmarit, and had compared that lens to the ASPH and SA
>> separately, indicating that that lens would have ended up in last place.
>> Some other 21's such as the Kobalux lenses also would not have touched the
>> ASPH, but some samples were quite good.
>>> 
>>> The Ricoh was the poorest in most respects, but not by a large margin,
>> and the ASPH was definitely the best in most respects. The SA and CV 
>> lenses
>> each had strong points and weak points, but both were very useable. Since
>> then I've tried a number of newer lenses like the Zeiss 21's, both of 
>> which
>> can compete very well with the Elmarit ASPH and are definitely better than
>> the CV 21. But again, they're larger, and the Biogon is even slower.
>>> 
>>> The main problem I've seen with the CV is decentering, which
>> unfortunately affects many other CV products. A lot of samples need some
>> stopping down to bring some corners into good performance. That's were a 
>> lot
>> of the money goes with Leica lenses.
>>> 
>>> In comparison to the 15 and 12mm lenses, I find that the 21 a) has a lot
>> of competition, which the others don't, and b) there's not a lot of
>> difference in performance, and certainly the 21 and 15 have a quite 
>> similar
>> character.
>>> 
>>> As for Ken Rockwell's 'tests' and 'opinions', the less said the better.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> At 1:42 AM -0400 4/3/10, Mark Rabiner wrote:
>>>>> Rabs, I said "BY ALL REPORTS" competitive since I have no idea whether
>> it's
>>>>> competitive or not; just telling you about the *reviews* out there.
>> Gandy
>>>>> for one but ok he has an interest in the matter. But -- since you've
>> already
>>>>> mentioned the technically knowledgeable though aesthetically wanting,
>> often
>>>>> goofy, and I suspect on other fronts dumbass closet right wing, Ken
>> Rockwell
>>>>> , I offer first this:
>>>>> 
>>>>> *<<This Voigtl?nder 21mm lens is the best 21mm lens ever made for Leica
>>>>> cameras, regardless of price....This lens is tiny, and works at least
>> as
>>>>> well optically as anything ever sold by Leica.....It is as sharp, and
>>>>> sometimes sharper, than the $4,300 Leica 21mm f/2.8
>>>>> ASPH<http://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/21mm-f28-asph.htm>to which I
>>>>> compared it directly.
>>>>> *
>>>>> 
>>>>> *How can this be? Probably because this Voigtl?nder lens is only f/4,
>> which
>>>>> is far easier to design and manufacture than trying to push things with
>> the
>>>>> modern f/2.8 ASPH lens from Leica, which has to be much bigger and much
>> more
>>>>> expensive just to retain the same optical quality. It costs a lot in
>> many
>>>>> ways to add just one stop of lens speed. *
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I've been harping on this for years on the lug what you just said. The
>>>> wonders of slow glass to the effect...
>>>> Every once in a while Leica gets smart and gives us a slow option.
>> Instead
>>>> of listening to the marketing people and making us pay 8 grand for a
>> huge
>>>> thing you'd not want to carry around all day and have a filter size
>> which is
>>>> the same size as the platters at the Yankee pot roast family restaurant.
>>>> Traditionally  in the Leica catalog you got a slow medium and fast
>> option
>>>> for about very focal length.
>>>> The slow lenes are slow.
>>>> But will have less flare and result at least as well as not better than
>> the
>>>> high priced spread. Compact.
>>>> So there is a gap which Cosina has filled with the help of the typefaces
>> &
>>>> fonts from  Voigtl?nder and Zeiss family heirlooms. And the power of
>> mind
>>>> over matter on the part of their customers who want with all their might
>> to
>>>> think they are buying a Zeiss lens for a few hundred dollars.
>>>> I do wish I had some of these options when I was getting my glass in the
>>>> 90's
>>>> We keep forgetting that  we don't need 1.4 to see thought the darned
>> thing.
>>>> It can be a 5.6 our viewfinder rangefinder is just as bright and sharp.
>>>> For many photographers they don't know it but that is their real speed
>>>> issue. They just want a bright groundglass.
>>>> Well we don't need no stinkin groundglass. We can get sharp as  tack
>>>> focusing with an f 11 lens. If anyone ever made one. If the did I'd buy
>> it.
>>>> But I'm been using my twinkie light.
>>>> 
>>>> [Rabs]
>>>> Mark William Rabiner
>>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>>  *            Henning J. Wulff
>>> /|\      Wulff Photography & Design
>>> /###\   mailto:henningw at archiphoto.com
>>> |[ ]|     http://www.archiphoto.com
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Leica Users Group.
>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> // richard <http://www.imagecraft.com/>
> // icc blog: <http://imagecraft.wordpress.com>
> // photo blog: <http://www.5pmlight.com>
> [ For technical support on ImageCraft products, please include all previous
> replies in your msgs. ]
> 
> _______________________________________________
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In reply to: Message from mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner) ([Leica] widest lens used?)
Message from s.dimitrov at charter.net (slobodan Dimitrov) ([Leica] widest lens used?)
Message from richard at imagecraft.com (Richard Man) ([Leica] widest lens used?)