[Leica] I wish the LUG was a harsher place. (Long Ramble)

[hopsternew at gmail.com (Geoff Hopkinson)]

Hi Neil. I think this is a worthwhile topic and that you have raised some
thoughtful points.
Here are some comments from me.
I agree with your impression that non-memorable images tend to garner little
on-list response and also that we often see more reactions, including
praise, on higher profile contributor's work.
I think that there are a number of factors at work.
The LUG is a social group with friends and personalities and a broad range
of relationships and expectations.
The volume too means that people will inevitably be selective and of course
have varying interests.
I certainly make more efforts for friends and filter others. I'm sure that
both of those apply in reverse with others when I post too, of course. A
core of members, including myself, post a lot and there is a risk of serial
overposting (guilty!) so often I will discuss work with friends off list
rather than post again. Some measures to ameleriorate that volume get
suggested occasionally, such as posting thank you's and attaboys off-list.

In my opinion, the best way to encourage more detailed and active comments
on your own work is simply to make the effort yourself to post the type of
response that you would like to receive from your own picture posts. It
takes considerable effort.
Leap in. If you have a different viewpoint on a comment, post a few lines,
ask why or say where you differ.
Lots of members look at everything posted about their images and evaluate
the comments. Candidly, I always take into account my own views of the
commenter's work or experience etc etc. Again to encourage discussion,
reciprocate in kind.




> >
> >   I bought an M9 recently and a few lenses,  revived my dormant
> >> photography habit and started posting to the LUG again.  In that short
> time
> >> I think my photography has improved and its all down to people being
> honest
> >> with me.
> >>
> >> The most important thing I've learned since getting the M9 is what kind
> of
> >> photographer I want to be.  I don't do beautiful landscapes because I
> >> haven't got the patience or inclination to get up at 4 in the morning
> for
> >> the right light or spend hours in photoshop honing a print and I also
> know
> >> that I'd still be pretty bad at it because frankly I find most landscape
> >> photography boring. I'd rather just go there on my bike and look at the
> >> scenery.  I'll never be a photojournalist because I think to do it
> justice
> >> you need to immerse yourself in your subject and make sure that your
> >> pictures tell the whole story you wanted to tell.  I have a young family
> and
> >> a full time job and this means that my pictures are limited to my
> children
> >> (and I don't post those anywhere) and the things I see in London in my
> 30-40
> >> minute walks two or three times a week and on my cycle ride to the
> railway
> >> station.  The pictures I try to take now show what I see in such short
> time
> >> periods.
> >>
> >> This group is a great place to force you into some self-reflection. For
> >> example some pictures I took of a climate camp in Trafalgar Square were
> >> failures because I didn't have the time to spend building the story and
> the
> >> subject demanded nothing less.   This was pointed out to me pretty
> quickly.
> >>  A few years ago Ted laid into a picture I took of a street singer in
> New
> >> York because it said nothing and he was absolutely right, it was a duff
> >> picture.  The upshot of all this is that I'm pretty certain now when I
> take
> >> a picture about what I'm trying to say or show and am much more severe
> with
> >> myself when I'm editing if the picture doesn't match the idea.  This
> makes
> >> it much easier to explain what I saw in a picture if I think its a
> keeper.
> >>
> >> I've learned a lot from the negative criticism my pictures receive and
> >> almost nothing from the praise (although I've got an ego like everyone
> else
> >> and all praise is welcome).  I think the LUG can be a bit too gentle on
> >> posters some times, perhaps with the idea that any photographic effort
> >> should be encouraged.  I'd love to see much more questioning of posters
> >> about why they think their picture works and much more honesty if stuff
> is
> >> just no good.  I've noticed that bad photographs tend to get ignored
> rather
> >> than actively criticised while good ones get loads of responses. This is
> a
> >> shame, really good pictures aren't the ones that need criticism although
> I
> >> can understand that this is quite a friendly place and we want to be
> nice to
> >> each other.
> >>
> >> Anyway, thanks to anyone who's said they liked my pictures and many many
> >> thanks to people who said they didn't.
> >>
> >> Neil
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Leica Users Group.
> >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> --
> Cheers
> Geoff
> http://www.pbase.com/hoppyman
>