Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2001/03/16

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Subject: Re: [Leica] Re: Bessa-T - let me get this straight...
From: Isaac Crawford <>
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 15:44:44 -0500
References: <9DC5E2ABE65BD54CA9088DA3194461D604A99A66@BBY1EXM01> <> <>

Marc James Small wrote:
> At 10:17 AM 3/16/2001 -0800, Ted Grant wrote:
> >>>>>There IS, of course, the intellectually dishonest Cosina management
> >> and, I suppose, a Cosina board room.<<<<
> >
> >I wondered why you made this comment? Not a chain pull, but an honest
> >question as I really don't understand.
> If Cosina had one ounce of honesty, they would list their goods as being
> made by Cosina and not by "Voigtländer".  The products are NOT made by
> Voigtländer, a defunct German company.  They are made by Cosina.  Why is
> Cosina so afeared of using their own name on their own products?
> This is a LEICA Users' Group.  I was unaware I belonged to a COSINA Users'
> Group.  I do belong to several Lists which involve the real Voigtlander
> name and heritage, and am an early member of the Voigtländer Verein, the
> Mark organization.  

They have bought the rights to the name, get over it... No, it is not
the original German company, who cares? The same thing has happened to
numerous companies' names all in the name of capitalism. The old
company, as good as the equipment may have been. is no more, I would
think that keeping the name alive and in the lexicon of younger
photographers should be worth something to an historian...

But, again, this is the LEICA Users' Group, and let it
> rest their.

The C/V equipment certainly belongs here... Would you ban all talk of
Tokina on a Nikon list? Of course not... if we can use it on a Leica we
should talk about it here. Besides, Leica's new equipment offerings are
few and far between, this is just the newest stuff to talk about right
now, it'll blow over soon... Yes this is the Leica users group, and
sometimes we *use* things other than Leica on or with our camera... if
want to join a collector's group I believe Mr. Gandy is starting one!:-)
> I recognize that Stephen Gandy, as a vendor, has a vested fiscal interest
> in this issue, and that Tom Abrahamson appears to have the same (note:  he
> has NOT denied that he receives goodies or money or favors from Cosina!).

Please... Does this make them a less good source of info? Sure I have to
keep in mind that Gandy sells stuff, but I also have to filter out your
inexplicable hatred of Cosina to get useful info from you. To imply that
Tom A. is anything but a Leica devotee is lunacy, even if he might get
some favors from Cosina. I say more power to him!
> Again, Ted, does the word "E T H I C S" mean anything to you?
> Cosina seems to have no ethics.  If they did, they would quit this hiding
> behind the "Voigtländer" name and would be honest enough to list their
> products in their own name.

What are you talking about? Has there ever been honesty is marketing?
Like it or not, names are for sale, and if a company thinks that it will
help them make more sales, they will be sure to use it (Look at Zeiss
with the Sonnar label on the new T3...). Cosina is no fool, they knew
what their reputation was, and they felt that they needed something to
show that this was different, a higher quality line than what people
were used to. They bought the name fair and square, this is hardly a
crime against humanity. Once again, what is worse, the name being
labeled on some new, decent gear, or have the name be dead, a part of
ancient history?

> Marc
>  FAX:  +540/343-7315
> Cha robh bas fir gun ghras fir!

In reply to: Message from Paul Chefurka <> (RE: [Leica] Re: Bessa-T - let me get this straight...)
Message from Marc James Small <> (Re: [Leica] Re: Bessa-T - let me get this straight...)
Message from Marc James Small <> (Re: [Leica] Re: Bessa-T - let me get this straight...)