Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2012/03/22

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Subject: [Leica] B&W Leica?
From: mark at (Mark Rabiner)
Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 22:04:10 -0400

I printed 40 x 80 from 35mm negs twice.
I went through three ten sheet boxes of the stuff.
Most of it was medium format film some black and white but run through the
Kreonite processor. But some of it was 35mm and not all of it slow film.
And it held together farily well. As long as it was not right next to a
print done with the medium format neg.
To get that size from a digital capture I guess we're talking medium format.
But a normal full frame capture from a Canon or Nikon full frame digital can
get quite large I'd think 16x20 inch no problem. And the high rez versions
of these sensors in bodes I'd think 20x24.
So I don't think digital is cramping our style.
Minor white said any print bigger than 16x20 was not archival becuae the
museums were not equipped to store them properly. I think most people think
of it as your classic serious print size with 20 x 24 much more rare. And
bigger than that is almost tacky.

Mark Rabiner

> From: Lew Schwartz <lew1716 at>
> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at>
> Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 19:34:17 -0400
> To: Leica Users Group <lug at>
> Subject: Re: [Leica] B&W Leica?
> Yes, yes. The thing is, one wants the most possible quality in the
> least possible space & size. Right now, both my M9 and scanned 35mm
> are good enough for 10x15 digital prints (including TX at 1600 boiled
> in Acufine). It's inebriating to think of getting MF quality out of
> the same camera. What happens if my sure-fire Pulitzer needs to be
> blown up to 30x45 feet for the Grand Central Terminal installation?
> I'm screwed.
> On Thu, Mar 22, 2012 at 12:42 PM, Mark Rabiner <mark at> 
> wrote:
>> Me too, Lew. On the "I-don't-really-get-it mix" end.
>> But on the non theoretical end people are making monochrome images from
>> their raw files from standard digital cameras EVERY DAY.
>> Nobody told them about the evils of their Bayer layers in their cameras.
>> Its like dying and going to heaven the way we can WYSIWYG real time
>> filtering so that separation in the image can be maximized and made to 
>> look
>> exactly as the photographer wishes. As could not be done with a 1001 gels
>> and glass filters in the field.
>> There is no talk about the lack of quality of these images.
>> There is no talk about ?about the need to make them sharper or better.
>> A black and white sensor camera is a fix for something which ain't broken
>> but is quite the opposite... Doing real well.
>> As far as black and white image making the digital age is a New 
>> Renaissance.
>> A new dream come true.
>> The black and white digital camera thing is a hold over from when black 
>> and
>> white film photographers were faced with the daunting task of 
>> understanding
>> and working with digital photography in the 1990s. And they were faced 
>> with
>> the unsavory idea of having a camera in hand which shot color. Kodak made 
>> a
>> black and white body and that was the obvious direction we thought we 
>> should
>> take. (I'm someone with then a black and white darkroom going way back)
>> Though I believe that and the other bodies of Kodaks were fairly 
>> disastrous
>> in a highly experimental climate of early digital photography.
>> If someday someone makes a monochrome 24x36mm digital sensor and makes a
>> large print with it from it which looks close to what you get from a 
>> medium
>> format digital sensor than people will sit up and take notice. A market 
>> for
>> the product will reveal itself instantly and the product then would have 
>> the
>> justification for being put into production.
>> Until that time its ghostware being theorized mainly by people who have a
>> big problem with digital photography and would rather shoot film with
>> results we'll not be likely to ever see.
>> In the end a horrible thing happened. Digital photography got me doing a
>> much higher percentage of color over black and white. And I didn't die and
>> go to hell.
>> --
>> Mark Rabiner
>>> From: Lew Schwartz <lew1716 at>
>>> Reply-To: Leica Users Group <lug at>
>>> Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 00:44:07 -0400
>>> To: Leica Users Group <lug at>
>>> Subject: Re: [Leica] B&W Leica?
>>> I'll just throw this into the I-don't-really-get-it mix: If the
>>> sensors are deficient in registering any part of the spectrum, it
>>> seems to me that it'd be pretty easy to compensate in the firmware
>>> before or after writing it into storage.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Leica Users Group.
>>> See for more information
>> _______________________________________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See for more information
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
> See for more information

Replies: Reply from abridge at (Adam Bridge) ([Leica] B&W Leica?)
In reply to: Message from lew1716 at (Lew Schwartz) ([Leica] B&W Leica?)