Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2009/08/13

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Subject: [Leica] M9 - not much more expensive than M8?
From: frank.dernie at btinternet.com (FRANK DERNIE)
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2009 06:46:44 +0000 (GMT)

The problem with the Olympus E3 I have is twofold. Firstly the AA filter is 
very strong, so much so that it can not be used for lens evaluation since it 
cuts out a lot of the sharpness information. The best Oly lenses are largely 
wasted on it. It is a well documented shortcoming, and something Oly have 
addressed on more recent offerings. It means MTF comparisons are pointless.
The other was that the auto-focus on long lenses was hit-and-miss, many 
others had this problem with the long lenses. My old Canon d30 had a much 
higher hit rate on birds in flight.
I really wanted to like the E3 since it is the only 4/3 camera I know with a 
nice viewfinder and I was a long time OM1 user. My main reason for trying it 
was the size and speed of the long lenses, I gave up on these. For "normal" 
use the E3 and lenses are no smaller or lighter than other formats, and I 
already had them.
cheers,
Frank

--- On Thu, 13/8/09, Richard Man <richard.lists at gmail.com> wrote:

> From: Richard Man <richard.lists at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Leica] M9 - not much more expensive than M8?
> To: "Leica Users Group" <lug at leica-users.org>
> Date: Thursday, 13 August, 2009, 8:12 PM
> Calm down Geoff :-) I am not leaving
> the Church of Leica.
> 
> I dispute the claim that the M8 pics are much sharper. Why
> don't we
> compare MTF charts :-)? The 35-100 is not the sharpest at
> F2, but at
> 2.8, it competes well. The 12-60 is stellar at wide open,
> but of
> course it's 2-4 stops slower than a 'lux. Blaming autofocus
> errors
> are.... unfruitful, as the Leica does not have autofocus.
> So autofocus
> on the M8 and adjust as needed.
> 
> As for Colo(u)rs, sure one can tweak anything to look like
> anything
> else, and no, I do not shoot JPG, and no, despite some
> questions I
> have asked you, I am quite familiar with RAW etc. thank you
> very much.
> I know how to use preset on import etc. In anycase, out of
> the box,
> Olympus Colors directly from a LR/ACR default conversion
> wins hands
> down against just anything else.Yes, of course I can say
> it's better
> colors. If Frank and Nathan can say sharper pics :-) That's
> one of the
> things that Olympus really got right.
> 
> In any case, enjoy your Leica lens. Really. I do of mine. I
> don't see
> reasons to use the E-3 unless I need the zoom or the tele
> and macro
> capabilities. So about 20% for me. I don't have tons of
> gears per se,
> only one 50, one 35, and one 75, but they are all 'lux ASPH
> (except
> for the 75 of course). I don't spend hours adjusting in LR,
> except for
> dusting when I shoot film.
> 
> On Thu, Aug 13, 2009 at 6:04 AM, Geoff Hopkinson<hopsternew at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Aah Richard you need to come to terms with how Raw
> files are converted. You
> > cannot say that camera X or Camera Y produces
> "better"' colour. You can say
> > that Camera X ,using default conversion settings
> produces files that please
> > me more. that is perfectly valid bit is not an
> objective assessment or
> > comparison. You are describing the whatever default
> conversion settings in
> > whatever conversion software you are using, I think.
> > Unless you are shooting jpgs! ?In that case I shall
> be over to spank you
> > shortly! Seriously this is a large subject of course.
> Just to pick Lightroom
> > or Adobe Camera Raw for examples, the default
> conversion settings for M8
> > DNGs are quite conservative. They are only defaults.
> ?The E3 appears to be
> > an excellent dSLR in my limited handling of it and
> files I have. However
> > Nathan is indisputably correct. Your M8 and good Leica
> glass will produce
> > demonstrably better images than the E3 and the best of
> the very good Oly
> > lenses, all else being equal.
> > I fear that 17 people will leap in with contrary
> positions some of them
> > perhaps based on criticising Leica or M8s on principle
> or for entertainment.
> > However, if you like to share some basics on your
> current process, I'm
> > confident that the subject is worthy and you should
> end up better prepared
> > to extract more from your new M8. You've only had it a
> few days, trust me
> > your horizons are going to get bigger! ?Define better
> colour for you. More
> > saturated, higher contrast? more natural appearing?
> What colour space are
> > you converting into? How are you comparing the output?
> Computer screen?
> > prints? Squinting at the LCD preview? What profile are
> you using in LR2?
> > Can I suggest that you choose one attribute at a time
> , I mean focus is a
> > separate issue for example, as is your exposure
> technique.
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> // richard m: richard @imagecraft.com
> // w: http://www.imagecraft.com/pub/Portfolio09/ blog:
> http://rfman.wordpress.com
> // book: http://www.blurb.com/bookstore/detail/745963
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> information
> 


In reply to: Message from richard.lists at gmail.com (Richard Man) ([Leica] M9 - not much more expensive than M8?)