Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2008/03/20

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Subject: [Leica] Re: Dave's PAW (*) 2008 #11
From: kididdoc at (Steve Barbour)
Date: Thu Mar 20 10:10:41 2008
References: <> <003801c88a24$c56ab6a0$6b01a8c0@dadquad>

On Mar 19, 2008, at 5:53 PM, Geoff Hopkinson wrote:
> David, you are enjoying Lomo photographs and decrying the M8?
> That is quite an extraordinary statement. Clearly you still have  
> strongly
> held emotional views on the M8.

c'mon Geoff, really.....go easy on the guy. He loves his Diana and he  
has done some extraordinary images with it.
Besides, over on the Diana list he shows his M8 photos, and rags on  
the Diana...what a cheap piece of junk it is, and how it's so noisy.
give him a break,  would ya...


> Naturally you are perfectly entitled to
> express them here. It just seems to me to be a provocative and
> confrontational statement to make in this venue. No-one's views are  
> likely
> to be swayed for or against the M8 by emotive statements, maybe I  
> can offer
> a couple of reasoned comments anyway.
> If you have an opportunity to use the camera, you might discover some
> fabulously clean and sharp, saturated images. Mine already has shown  
> me
> output from my lenses beyond anything I ever saw using film (and I was
> extremely fond of my M7). You can use the camera in any manner you  
> choose.
> Chimping is not compulsory. Just use that LCD to access the clear and
> intuitive menus for settings. The only other 'digital gizmo' I see  
> is a
> frame counter and battery level window. I don't know what you  
> envision as a
> means of displaying camera information without the LCD.
> For my taste I would prefer an analog dial for exposure compensation  
> maybe.
> I was always a fan of the Contax approach with the G or N cameras for
> example. But you could shoot for a year and only ever change the ISO
> setting, if you wanted. There is an option to turn off image display  
> all
> together. I have mine in a half case with a flap that covers the  
> LCD. This
> keeps the LCD clean as an additional benefit. If you want to access  
> the
> exposure or colour temperature or check focus or composition etc
> information, it is there whenever you like to look.
> As to the shutter sound, are you suggesting that it was practical to  
> put a
> rubberized cloth blind shutter in front of the sensor? Following vocal
> criticism, Leica has offered an option to change to a quieter  
> version of the
> modern shutter, if owners consider that an important issue. If there  
> is
> eventually a successor to the camera, I imagine that this new design  
> might
> be standard. Right now Leica is making an effort to offer an optional
> upgrade path into the future for people who have the current camera.  
> I think
> that is a laudable thing for them to attempt. I am not bothered by the
> shutter re-cocking noise at all.
> To become competent with the M8, requires effort as with any camera.  
> For me
> exposure control for the sensor and frame-line accuracy both need  
> learning.
> Did I mention that the camera makes technically superb photographs  
> if you do
> your part?
> None of that changes your opinion one whit, I would think ;-) Never  
> mind, I
> like to express my opinion here as well.
> I confess that I completely fail to understand the cult of the Lomo,  
> but its
> enthusiasts clearly enjoy it. Good luck to them.
> Cheers
> Geoff
> -----Original Message-----
> Subject: [Leica] Re: Dave's PAW (*) 2008 #11
>> Dave,
>> Like your Diana pics a lot. Also, of course the RD1's. Your style,  
>> it is.
>> BTW, I remember your bitter disenchantment at the time of the M8
>> presentation. Has your perception of that camera changed in any way?
>> cheers,
>> ed a
> Ed --
> Thanks for your support.
> Ah, the poor, pathetic M8... I remain completely in the camp that
> believes the M8 was a horrible, nearly failed, attempt at advancing
> the M camera into the digital age.
> Some of Leica's (vain?) attempts to "upgrade" the camera, particularly
> the replacement of the shutter, I think vindicates some of my initial
> criticism. It was, after all, the first click of the shutter when I  
> viewed
> the
> camera at Photokina in 2006 that utterly destroyed my dream of a
> digital M camera.
> I regret to say that I do not see anything on the horizon that will
> change my opinion -- lest Leica take an M7 and replace the film
> mechanism with a digital sensor. No LCD, no other external
> digital gizmos. That would be a "true" digital M. But I hear that
> hell rarely freezes over...
> Dave.
> -- 
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> 2008 PAW Gallery:
> Web Site:
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> Leica Users Group.
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Replies: Reply from hoppyman at (Geoff Hopkinson) ([Leica] Re: Dave's PAW (*) 2008 #11)
In reply to: Message from ausdlk at (David Keenan) ([Leica] Re: Dave's PAW (*) 2008 #11)
Message from hoppyman at (Geoff Hopkinson) ([Leica] Re: Dave's PAW (*) 2008 #11)