Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2007/07/31

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Subject: [Leica] IMG: composition
From: kididdoc at cox.net (Steve Barbour)
Date: Tue Jul 31 17:07:31 2007
References: <0JM000CGRI0AKK60@l-daemon> <4BDB65D7-BE9E-44AA-9CD2-71320FD8D89F@pandora.be>

On Jul 31, 2007, at 1:43 PM, Philippe Orlent wrote:

> Well Ted, it will be an honour.
>
> First, I want to thank you, and all those that responded.
> I somewhat predicted the outcome, but it was an interesting  
> experiment proving that the audience doesn't always agree, even if  
> you like a shot. And, in the end, and unless one would like to  
> spend his life in complete excile, the audience is the most important.
> I will not go into describing of what makes an audience, quid  
> quantifying and qualifying 'target groups', because, just like  
> statistics, it can prove about any axiom. Which is a contradiction  
> anyway.
> But let's not wander off.
>
> About the first posted, then withdrawn, then reposted image (and  
> only for comparison reasons).
> Yes, it has smooth tonalities, yes it captures the boy's aiming,  
> yes it captures a typical boyish action, yes the composition is OK.
> But i find it terribly dull. And not at all capturing the essence  
> of kids. Being: never a moment of rest when awake.
>
> Which brings us to the second -and my preferred but very rightly  
> put into question- image.
> Before I try to explain why I called it 'composition', which IMO it  
> is more than anything else, something about how it originated.
>
> It was shot on a photographically very productive weekend when we  
> went visiting one of my 2 brothers. Both of them have only boys,  
> and it is always interesting for me to observe them, having 2  
> daughters myself (and coming form a nest with 3 boys).
> My youngest brother lives close to the Belgian coast. All Belgians  
> do BTW: max distance from any place in Belgium to its -only- coast  
> is about 120 miles. But he lives in Bruges, and that's just a 15  
> min drive. So when we're there, and the weather's fine, off we go.
>
> Boys and sand are a magical combination: they immediately start  
> digging, building, making camps etc. It takes them hours, and never  
> they pause.: always acitve, never a moment of rest. It must be a  
> Jungian thing...
> Being used to my daughters, who BTW were gently playing on a beach  
> towel, or just sunbathing, this was like my own youth coming back  
> to me.
> One difference though: being used to our girls, I found it quite  
> 'exhausting' to constantly follow the 2 boys in their action :-)
> This lead to a mental state of looking, but not very attentively.
> In such case, the eye tends to focus on the background (infinity  
> focus, so to speak): every foreground motion will be noticed, but  
> OOF. Until the OOF motion gives alert signals: then the eye will  
> refocus.
> In other words: looking to this scene through my VF, my mind  
> wandered off, and I shot it almost inconsciently.
> When revising it later on, the shot grasped my attention: it  
> captured exactly what I was seeing (and feeling) at that moment.
>
> I judged it interesting, because even in that case (completely OOF  
> in classical terms of speaking), it not only captured what I saw,  
> but it also exactly showed what the boy (Jules is his name) was  
> doing, with a minimum of information.
> Which, for me, in about any form of visual reproduction, is  
> paramount: give as much information as possible, with a minimum of  
> elements. It's so much more exciting to leave the (exact)  
> reconstruction of a scene to the viewer instead of giving him so  
> much that his personal interpretation becomes irrelevant.
>
> Secondly, when revising, and knowing that it was shot  
> inconsciently, I found it remarkably well balanced. Which is also a  
> big thing for me, because I have too much a tendency to  
> (painstakingly) compose, thus literally construct an image (one of  
> the reasons why I love an M, BTW: it just forces you to shoot  
> pensatively). And I'd love to get to a point where composition  
> comes naturally. Because it will make my images more natural. I think.
>
> That's why I called it 'composition'.
>
> I tried to show what makes it into (IMO) a composed and balanced  
> image here:
> <http://www.fullflavor.be/_POR0869_comp.jpg>
>
> What it all boils down to: it is full of repetitions (tone and  
> form), parallels, and balanced proportions.
> Which is pretty remarkable for a completely intuitive shot.


Philippe,

a wonderful and forceful analysis....which I completely understand....


but,


I am a believer that the image must say it...

and better than words,

in fact the more words needed to explain it, the weaker the image...


when I look at the image, the things that it means to you...

don't come to me clearly from the image...

maybe I wasn't prepared prior to seeing,

I just don't have the emotional  ....yes, right, wow... reaction to  
the photo, whether I can put it into words or not...


I am just not emotionally/intellectually prepared for it as you are...


I guess that's why different images mean different things to  
different people...


Steve






>
> So yes, I'm pretty proud of it, and I hope later on it will prove  
> to be a benchmark in my photography. Ahem.
> BTW: some liked it too. Strangely enough offlist ;-)
>
> Hell, maybe I should become a Lomo adept again? ;-P
>
> Philippe
>
>
> Op 30-jul-07, om 23:50 heeft Ted Grant het volgende geschreven:
>
>> Philippe Orlent showed & asked:
>> Subject: [Leica] IMG: composition
>>
>>
>>
>>>>> That's what I consider it to be.
>>
>> I won't pull this one back like I did with the former posting, rest
>>
>> assured.
>>
>> But I'm suspecting that I might be one of the few that like it.
>>
>> <http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/phorlent/_POR0869.jpg.html>
>>
>>
>>
>> Philippe mon ami,
>>
>>
>>
>> Before I offer a critique, a question? As I'm sure others may wish  
>> to know
>> also. Would you please explain why you cropped or shot or why you  
>> like the
>> composition in this manner as it is?
>>
>>
>>
>> In that fashion we the viewers will understand how you see and  
>> feel about
>> the picture. Certainly more so than one word "composition." Thank  
>> you.
>>
>>
>>
>> ted
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>
>
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Replies: Reply from tedgrant at shaw.ca (Ted Grant) ([Leica] IMG: composition)
In reply to: Message from tedgrant at shaw.ca (Ted Grant) ([Leica] IMG: composition)
Message from philippe.orlent at pandora.be (Philippe Orlent) ([Leica] IMG: composition)