Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2005/08/02

[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]

Subject: OT now, Was: [Leica] Piercings and Tatoos
From: telyt at earthlink.net (Douglas Herr)
Date: Tue Aug 2 14:44:51 2005

B.D., how is an arranged marriage discriminatory against the woman?  Isn't 
the man equally involved, and doesn't he have obligations toward the woman?

Doug Herr
Birdman of Sacramento
http://www.wildlightphoto.com


"B. D. Colen" <bdcolen@comcast.net> wrote:

> Not if you're the one doing the arrangement, or the male. ;-)
> 
> 
> On 8/2/05 4:13 PM, "Der Eiserne Reiter" <ferider@yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > I have several friends whose marriage was arranged. Another friend will 
> > be
> > getting
> > married soon, arranged back home by his family. Believing in arranged
> > marriages
> > has nothing to do with discrimination.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > 
> > Roland.
> > 
> > --- "B. D. Colen" <bdcolen@comcast.net> wrote:
> > 
> >> With all due respect, Jayanand, it's not a question of "liberal European
> >> thinking;" it's a question of whether one views women and men as 
> >> equals, or
> >> whether one views women as chattel, honored chattel in some societies, 
> >> but
> >> chattel none the less.
> >> 
> >> B. D.
> >> 
> >> 
> >> On 8/2/05 9:21 AM, "Jayanand Govindaraj" <jgovindaraj@eth.net> wrote:
> >> 
> >>> You equate an arranged marriage with female circumcision? Wow! Liberal
> >>> European thinking!!
> >>> Cheers
> >>> Jayanand Govindaraj
> >>> Chennai, India
> >>> (who has been happily married for 27 years through an arranged 
> >>> marriage, and
> >>> has had no problem with it)
> >>> 
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: "Nathan Wajsman" <nathan.wajsman@planet.nl>
> >>> To: "Leica Users Group" <lug@leica-users.org>
> >>> Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 10:30 AM
> >>> Subject: Re: [Leica] Piercings and Tatoos
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>>> Well, I feel like I understand quite a few different cultures because 
> >>>> of
> >>>> my rather nomadic life, the international family I am part of, my 
> >>>> Puerto
> >>>> Rican wife etc. I agree with Dennis' sentiment that we should respect 
> >>>> the
> >>>> fact that things are done differently in other cultures/religions, 
> >>>> but I
> >>>> do not agree that this implies that they are all equally valid,
> >>>> particularly in modern, liberal societies like the US or Europe. An
> >>>> arranged marriage, for me, is beyond the pale in the 21st century, as 
> >>>> is,
> >>>> for example, female circumcision--which after all, also is grounded 
> >>>> in a
> >>>> strong cultural tradition. In Denmark there have been cases of parents
> >>>> sending their daughters to Somalia to undergo this type of 
> >>>> mutilation, and
> >>>> of parents sending their daughters to rural Turkey or Pakistan for an
> >>>> arranged marriage against their will. Both types of activities are
> >>>> illegal, and rightly so.
> >>>> 
> >>>> As someone who has lived most of his life as an immigrant in four
> >>>> different countries, I say that if someone wants to live like that, 
> >>>> then
> >>>> they should do so in South Asia or wherever this type of tradition is
> >>>> considered normal. My guiding motto on this type of issue is the 
> >>>> wonderful
> >>>> American expression, "shit or get off the pot."
> >>>> 
> >>>> Strong family ties are all well and good, but not if they manifest
> >>>> themselves in coercion or in practices that are unacceptable to the 
> >>>> wider
> >>>> society. Some decades ago the Mormons had to accept that polygamy was 
> >>>> not
> >>>> acceptable in the United States and they abandoned this tradition 
> >>>> (yes, I
> >>>> am aware of the splinter groups that still cling to it, but mainstream
> >>>> Mormons do not). As far as I can tell from the Mormon friends and
> >>>> co-workers I had in the US, this has not had any negative impact on 
> >>>> their
> >>>> family ties or ability to practice their religion.
> >>>> 
> >>>> BTW, we know several South Asians (as evident from my latest PAWs), 
> >>>> many
> >>>> Muslims among them, who all live in thoroughly modern, voluntary
> >>>> marriages, in many cases to "infidels."
> >>>> 
> >>>> Nathan
> >>>> 
> >>>> Dennis Painter wrote:
> >>>> 
> >>>>> This is a very interesting set of photos. One certainly needs to 
> >>>>> know a
> >>>>> bit of what's going on here to understand them. I am glad that Tina 
> >>>>> is
> >>>>> working on this project as I doubt anyone could do better than her.
> >>>>> Despite that I am not sure photographs will lead to greater
> >>>>> understanding.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> Much has been said of and about different cultures and cultural
> >>>>> differences.  Here are my beliefs.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> It's almost impossible to truly understand another culture. Perhaps 
> >>>>> if
> >>>>> you know all the history, can read the language, and live within that
> >>>>> culture for years, then, you might really understand.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> If you apply your standards, your culture, against another you are 
> >>>>> lost
> >>>>> to understanding.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> The best way of "understanding" is to accept that what they believe 
> >>>>> and
> >>>>> do is correct to their way of life and culture. Respect their 
> >>>>> culture.
> >>>>> This helps greatly to avoid forming prejudice in your mind.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> It's hard for me to put this into words.
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> -- 
> >>>> Nathan Wajsman
> >>>> Almere, The Netherlands
> >>>> 
> >>>> General photography: http://www.nathanfoto.com
> >>>> Seville photography: http://www.fotosevilla.com
> >>>> Stock photography: http://www.alamy.com/search-results.asp?qt=wajsman
> >>>> http://myloupe.com/home/found_photographer.php?photographer=507
> >>>> Prints for sale: http://www.photodeluge.com
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> 
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Leica Users Group.
> >>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> >>>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Leica Users Group.
> >>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Leica Users Group.
> >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> >> 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ____________________________________________________
> > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
> > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
> >  
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Leica Users Group.
> > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

_______________________________________________
Leica Users Group.
See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information


Replies: Reply from nathan.wajsman at planet.nl (Nathan Wajsman) (OT now, Was: [Leica] Piercings and Tatoos)