[Leica] Green Shadows Example

Mon Apr 9 11:02:51 PDT 2018

I think part of the problem is that the printer you use has dye-based
inks, and the Ilford Fibre papers were designed for pigment inks. Why does
the Mono Silk look good for you and Fibre Silk doesn’t? I don’t know. The
profile Ilford provides for it may be more accurate.

Another possibility is that the base color of the paper is to blame. Gold
Fibre Silk does not use optical brighteners, and Mono Silk does. If you
look at the two papers side-by-side, the Mono Silk is a brighter, cooler
white, while the Fibre Silk is a slightly warmer white. The printer
profile should take that into account, but many times profiles are poorly
done and don’t give accurate prints.

Also, consider metamerism. This is when a print looks different when
viewed under different light sources. The profiles are made for prints to
be viewed under daylight. The inks in some printers will look radically
different under other light sources. I remember the old Epson 2200, my
first inkjet printer, had this problem in a big way. Under daylight,
prints looked AWESOME. Under incandescent light, they were very dark! The
r2400 I headwater was not as bad, but it was still an issue. The P800 is
MUCH better, there is very little metamerism with its inks. I don’t know
about the inks in your printer, I have never seen prints made with one.

If the Canson paper is working for you, stick with it. Life’s too short to
waste time and money trying to work with something that gives so much
hassle. Keep your Ilford paper in case you do get a P800.

-- 
Chris Crawford
Fine Art Photography
Fort Wayne, Indiana
260-437-8990

http://www.chriscrawfordphoto.com  My portfolio

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Christopher-Crawford/48229272798
Like My Work on Facebook

On 4/9/18, 11:12 AM, "LUG on behalf of Tina Manley via LUG"
<lug-bounces+chris=chriscrawfordphoto.com at leica-users.org on behalf of
lug at leica-users.org> wrote:

>PS:  I had a few sheets of Ilford Gold Mono Silk and tried those just out
>of curiosity.  They came out fine - beautiful color prints.  It's just the
>Gold Fibre Silk that is a problem.
>
>Tina
>
>On Mon, Apr 9, 2018 at 11:02 AM, Tina Manley <tmanley at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Chris!  I spent the morning watching your video which was
>> outstanding and very informative.  I learned a lot!  However, following
>>the
>> directions for using the Epson Color Controls (the Windows version is
>> different from the Mac but I think I got everything right) the print on
>>the
>> Ilford Gold Silk paper was about 10x worse!!   The green shadows were
>> unbelievably bad.  I printed it again with 1.8 Gamma chosen and it was
>> slightly better but still much worse than letting LightRoom apply the
>> Ilford profile.
>>
>> The only way I've managed to get rid of the green shadows is to change
>>to
>> another paper.  The Canson Platine print is beautiful, but that paper is
>> $132 for 25 sheets of 13x19!!
>>
>> I've ordered some Hahnemuhle Silk Baryata that I hope will work.  It's
>>not
>> cheap either!
>>
>> I'm also beginning to think I should have gotten the Epson P800 instead
>>of
>> the 1430 Artisan when I got a new printer.  I may order one if I can
>>figure
>> out how to justify the cost!!
>>
>> Thanks for your help.
>>
>> Tina
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 8, 2018 at 9:49 PM, Christopher Crawford <
>> chris at chriscrawfordphoto.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Tina,
>>>
>>> I have used Ilford Gold Fibre Silk for years for both color and BW
>>>prints.
>>> The Ilford Profile is the problem. It also renders saturated blues as
>>> purple, most frustrating in landscapes with blue skies.
>>>
>>> Here’s what I do for color printing with it:
>>>
>>> 1) In Lightroom or Photoshop, set your printing for “Printer Manages
>>> Colors.” You won’t be using a profile, we’re going to let the Epson
>>>driver
>>> handle color management.
>>>
>>> 2) In the Epson driver, set the media type to “Premium Semigloss.” Set
>>> Color Settings to “Epson Color Controls.” In the Print Settings screen,
>>> choose “Advanced Settings” and choose either sRGB or Adobe RGB. Choose
>>>the
>>> one that corresponds to the colorspace the image you’re printing is in.
>>>
>>> 3) Prints will have much more accurate color but may look slightly too
>>> dark. In the advanced settings, changing the Gamma from 2.2 to 1.8 will
>>> lighten the image enough to overcome that, though some occasionally
>>>look
>>> too light most will print perfectly this way.
>>>
>>> I made a video tutorial you can watch on how to do this:
>>>
>>> https://youtu.be/roWAfDfyCTA
>>>
>>> I hope this fixes your color problem. If not, you’re going to have to
>>> switch to another paper, or pay someone to do a custom profile for you.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Chris Crawford
>>> Fine Art Photography
>>> Fort Wayne, Indiana
>>> 260-437-8990
>>>
>>> http://www.chriscrawfordphoto.com  My portfolio
>>>
>>> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Christopher-Crawford/48229272798
>>> Like My Work on Facebook
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 4/8/18, 8:59 PM, "LUG on behalf of Tina Manley via LUG"
>>> <lug-bounces+chris=chriscrawfordphoto.com at leica-users.org on behalf of
>>> lug at leica-users.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> >I can't explain it then because I used the exact same digital photo
>>>and
>>> >profile and on the Ilford paper there are green shadows.  On the
>>>Canson
>>> >there are no green shadows.  I'll take an iphone photo of the Canson
>>>one
>>> >tomorrow and post it.  Jayanand said he had problems with color casts
>>>in
>>> >the Ilford paper and used it only for B&W.
>>> >
>>> >I ordered Hahnemuhle which was quite a bit more expensive but I hope I
>>> >won't waste as much as I have on the Ilford!
>>> >
>>> >Tina
>>> >
>>> >On Sun, Apr 8, 2018 at 8:40 PM, Brian Reid
>>><reid at mejac.palo-alto.ca.us>
>>> >wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Paper cannot synthesize or create green ink.
>>> >> Profiles can.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Leica Users Group.
>>> >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >--
>>> >Tina Manley
>>> >www.tinamanley.com
>>> >tina-manley.artistwebsites.com
>>> >http://www.alamy.com/stock-photography/3B49552F-90A0-4D0A-
>>> A11D-2175C937AA9
>>> >1/Tina+Manley.html
>>> >
>>> >_______________________________________________
>>> >Leica Users Group.
>>> >See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Leica Users Group.
>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Tina Manley
>> www.tinamanley.com
>> tina-manley.artistwebsites.com
>> http://www.alamy.com/stock-photography/3B49552F-90A0-
>> 4D0A-A11D-2175C937AA91/Tina+Manley.html
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>-- 
>Tina Manley
>www.tinamanley.com
>tina-manley.artistwebsites.com
>http://www.alamy.com/stock-photography/3B49552F-90A0-4D0A-A11D-2175C937AA9
>1/Tina+Manley.html
>
>_______________________________________________
>Leica Users Group.
>See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information