[Leica] Leica Fotographie Magazine downloads......

Bryan Caldwell bcaldwell51 at earthlink.net
Wed Jul 8 07:04:37 PDT 2015 

I did some checking (I’m an attorney) and much of this material is subject to a U.S. Copyright of 95 years without having to be renewed. Whether or not they are of historical significance is legally irrelevant, just as whether they are still in print is irrelevant. It is the copyright holder’s choice as to what is done with them. If the copyright holder chose to destroy them they would be completely entitled to do so.

“Fair use” is a term of art in copyright law. Two things that argue strongly against this falling within the fair use exception is that the works are reproduced in their entirety and that they are posted for download to all comers. My strong suspicion is that this would not fall within the fair use exception. Any disclaimer accompanying the downloads is meaningless.

Another way to look at this is to ask yourself how you would feel if someone gained access to your photographs and, without your permission, posted them to the world for download.

There are some potential sub-issues here as well. I assume that Leica Fotographie obtained releases from the photographers whose work is involved (as well as those photographers obtaining release from their subjects) and those releases may have been for limited use - a single publication, for instance. This current use may not just be infringing upon Leica Fotographie’s copyright, but against the copyright holders of the content within.

As much as I would like to, I will not be downloading any of this.

Bryan Caldwell


> On Jul 8, 2015, at 4:19 AM, Peter Dzwig <pdzwig at summaventures.com> wrote:
> 
> I agree, obviously I wish that he had got Leica's permission. I presume all the
> photogs ceded at least some of their rights to Leica.
> 
> If he is intending to create an archive of issues for public access and with at
> least a reasonable lifespan, then he is performing a service both to the Leica
> community and to photography as a whole, using copies which we assume that he
> purchased himself.
> 
> However I doubt that the archive will have permanence beyond maybe ten years or
> so, unless others get involved and Leica give it their blessing.
> 
> Obviously I understand your perspective but there is a tension here. If nothing
> were done a resource of historical importance - to some, at least -  would be
> lost. How do we resolve the issue between preserving an archive of any sort and
> copyright in this fast changing world? Private collections always were the route
> to preservation. There would after all be no British Museum without the Cotton
> Collection and bequest.
> 
> Peter
> 
> On 08/07/2015 06:18, Nathan Wajsman wrote:
>> Exactly!
>> 
>> Nathan Wajsman
>> 
>> Alicante, Spain
>> http://www.frozenlight.eu
>> http://www.greatpix.eu
>> PICTURE OF THE WEEK: http://www.fotocycle.dk/paws
>> Blog: http://nathansmusings.wordpress.com/
>> 
>> Cycling: http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/belgiangator
>> 
>> YNWA
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 08 Jul 2015, at 00:07, Bryan Caldwell <bcaldwell51 at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> The fact that something is out of print does not mean the copyright has lapsed. And, a disclaimer does not establish fair use. If the copyright holder chooses to challenge the use, that will be decided in a court of law. A disclaimer is no defense. Either it is fair use or it isn't. Something reproduced in its entirety tends to argue against fair use. Fair use is much more likely to apply to excerpts from protected material.
>>> 
>>> Bryan Caldwell
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Bill Clough <billclough042541 at gmail.com>
>>>> Sent: Jul 7, 2015 10:14 AM
>>>> To: Leica Users Group <lug at leica-users.org>
>>>> Subject: Re: [Leica] Leica Fotographie Magazine downloads......
>>>> 
>>>> Went to the download site an d got the 404 message.
>>>> 
>>>> --Bill
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Jul 7, 2015 at 12:08 PM, Nathan Wajsman <nwajsman at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> OK, looking at this “disclaimer”:
>>>>> 
>>>>> “These long out-of-print reference materials are presented under fair
>>>>> use—no challenge to any copyright held by Leica Camera is intended.”
>>>>> 
>>>>> My question is answered.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Nathan
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Nathan Wajsman
>>>>> 
>>>>> Alicante, Spain
>>>>> http://www.frozenlight.eu
>>>>> http://www.greatpix.eu
>>>>> PICTURE OF THE WEEK: http://www.fotocycle.dk/paws
>>>>> Blog: http://nathansmusings.wordpress.com/
>>>>> 
>>>>> Cycling: http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/belgiangator
>>>>> 
>>>>> YNWA
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 07 Jul 2015, at 07:10, Nathan Wajsman <photo at frozenlight.eu> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Is this legal?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Nathan Wajsman
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Alicante, Spain
>>>>>> http://www.frozenlight.eu
>>>>>> http://www.greatpix.eu
>>>>>> PICTURE OF THE WEEK: http://www.fotocycle.dk/paws
>>>>>> Blog: http://nathansmusings.wordpress.com/
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Cycling: http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/belgiangator
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> YNWA
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On 07 Jul 2015, at 07:03, Frank Filippone <red735i at verizon.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Per www.Leicarumors.com
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The website LeicaPhotographyArchive started uploading online scans of
>>>>> old
>>>>>>> Leica Photography magazines that can be used as a reference for anything
>>>>>>> related to Leica cameras and Leitz company. All scanned magazines can be
>>>>>>> accessed here. You can add the scans to your Google drive and then
>>>>> download
>>>>>>> them (total of 876MB so far). This is an ongoing project, so check the
>>>>>>> website in the future for new additions to the archive. Here is a
>>>>> screenshot
>>>>>>> of the currently available issues:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Go here..
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>> https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8lOGuzhswtkfkpycElRWGdNN0NvbjdJek1Y
>>>>>>> cHNmVnFyQVJTSUlScURhWTZJdVo1d1JDZGs
>>>>>>> <
>>>>> https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8lOGuzhswtkfkpycElRWGdNN0NvbjdJek1
>>>>>>> YcHNmVnFyQVJTSUlScURhWTZJdVo1d1JDZGs&usp=sharing> &usp=sharing
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Frank Filippone
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Red735i at verizon.net
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Leica Users Group.
>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> ===========================================================
> Dr Peter Dzwig				
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information

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