[Leica] Xtol recomended dilutions

[mark at rabinergroup.com (Mark Rabiner)]

Gerry many people use too much Photo flo and they get marks because of that.
You squeegee with your two fingers never a rubber thing or sponge.  Your 
first and second fingers. Really.
And I think Photo Flo is the reason why film dries well or messed up it 
takes care of hard water and most anything else but will be the problem 
itself just as often if  too much is used. 
Normally I?d say use  a cap from the bottle of photo flo as that?s what we 
always did but I check and the cap is way large now.
I check now and ?Available in 3 different concentrations? so you have to 
read the back of the bottle and if it doesn?t work try using half that 
amount.
It should not be all foamy. Only a hint of foam.

Kodak 1464510 Photo-flo 200 Wetting Agent
And if that doesn?t work get a gallon of Distilled water for a last dip only 
to put the photo flo in.
I put filters in my water lines I got from Calumet.  They?re from Chicago.

Mark William Rabiner

On 6/15/17, 5:07 PM, "LUG on behalf of Gerry Walden" 
<lug-bounces+mark=rabinergroup.com at leica-users.org on behalf of 
gerry.walden at icloud.com> wrote:

    Forgive me, but when I asked this question I just wanted to know whether 
there were any new kids on the block as far as developers went. I ssem to 
have stirred up a hornets nest.
    
    I remember now that I used to use Xtol 1:3 and it was about the best 
around. If I go back to home processing that is what I will use. My big 
problem is drying marks through film drying and final wash with very hard 
chalky water.
    
    Gerry
    
    Gerry Walden LRPS
    www.gwpics.com
    +44 (0)23 8046 3076 or
    +44 (0)797 287 7932
    
    
    
    
    
    
    > On 15 Jun 2017, at 17:31, Mark Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com> 
wrote:
    > 
    > Lluis I used to roll my film back to back two rolls in the same reel! 
And taught my assistants to do it. A few of them were incredulous.  I got 
this from a Bill Pierce column in Popular photography in the early 70?s it 
worked.
    > But it makes Kodak?s recommendations as to limits of Xtol and puts 
them in the dust.
    > I ran 8 rolls of 35mm film in a liter or quart of 1:3 Xtol.
    > Then dumped it down the drain. My times where close to what they 
should have been.
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > 
    > -- 
    > 
    > Mark William Rabiner
    > Photographer
    > 
    > On 6/15/17, 10:40 AM, "LUG on behalf of lluisripollphotography" 
<lug-bounces+mark=rabinergroup.com at leica-users.org on behalf of 
lluisripollphotography at gmail.com> wrote:
    > 
    >    Mark,
    > 
    >    Thank you for useful information, very interesting to learn it! You 
mention Delta 400, yes it is a great film, I?ve not use it after a while and 
just the past days I was in the darkroom enlarging, the pics with this one 
was very fine.
    > 
    >    Your recomendation about testing dilution is also very interesting 
to follow. 
    > 
    >    Thank you
    >    Lluis
    > 
    > 
    > 
    >> El 15 juny 2017, a les 14:25, Mark Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com> 
va escriure:
    >> 
    >> If you Bing it or Google it for 15 minutes you?ll see the top, smart, 
nice, funny spiritual people are all at 1:3. The ones whose prints sold for 
the most money and who dressed better.
    >> Diluting Xtol 1:3 instead of 1:2 ads a couple of more minutes to it 
its way worth it. With that you get better edge caracteristics which is 
directly linked to higher dilution. And other advantages I was using 1:2 for 
a while and my prints were obviously worse. 
    >> 
    >> By the way in my college in the early 70?s in St. Louis, we did us 
students who were always in the darkroom an unusual thing which I?d never 
heard of other places. We all ran our film in D76 1:2 instead of 1:1. The 
students who came in in the beginning of the year and ran the recommended 
1:1 and universal default had prints you could spot across the room as being 
way less sharp. Way less edge. And way less sharp grain. But a tad less 
grain. And they were not very nice people who told bad jokes. It looked like 
they were shooting with Spiratone lenes.
    >> A good policy is to dilute until you hit a point when you?re seeing 
uneven development in your negs. Washed out areas. Then you back up a notch. 
But you?ll ahead of time see what everyone else is doing.
    >> Neopan Acros 100 Xtol 1:3 16? minutes 70 degrees? agitation every 
minute and the first full minute.
    >> All film listed here is 1:3 70 degrees F, agitation every minute 10 
seconds and the first full minute.
    >> Delta 100    14?
    >> Delta 3200  16?
    >> Delta 400     14? Neopan 1600 RIP my main film when out and about 
shooting for myself. Even with a Noctilux.   12 minutes and looks like an 
iso 100 film. And here you are shooting it on the street. No tripod. I used 
it for on location commercial jobs no flash or tripod. The 100 with the 
studio strobes in the studio. Delta 100 from Ilford as just about as good.
    >> Neopan Acros 100 16 ? as high a rez film anyone would ever want or 
need in Xtol 1:3
    >> Get a tank so you can develop 8 rolls at a time or I can see your 
point and wanting to keep shorter times.
    >> You?ll shoot more with a big boy tank.
    >> Pan F 50, they still make it.  12?
    >> Tri X 400  11?
    >> Tri X Pro 320 in 120 or 220 format, 15?
    >> All the other times here is for 35mm format. Times are different for 
different formats why no one knows.
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >> -- 
    >> 
    >> Mark William Rabiner
    >> Photographer
    >> 
    >> On 6/15/17, 7:32 AM, "LUG on behalf of lluisripollphotography" 
<lug-bounces+mark=rabinergroup.com at leica-users.org on behalf of 
lluisripollphotography at gmail.com> wrote:
    >> 
    >>   Chris, Dan
    >> 
    >>   I will do 1+1 on my next two films, I want avoid long develping 
times. I?ve used HC110 many years ago, but I liked better ID11/D76
    >> 
    >>   Cheers
    >>   Lluis
    >> 
    >> 
    >> 
    >>> El 15 juny 2017, a les 11:49, Christopher Crawford <chris at 
chriscrawfordphoto.com> va escriure:
    >>> 
    >>> Its been years since I used Xtol. I never really liked the tonality 
as
    >>> much as D-76, though Xtol does give finer grain. I got best results
    >>> diluted 1+1.
    >>> 
    >>> Be careful with higher dilutions. Kodak, when it first came out, 
listed
    >>> times for 1+2 and 1+3 dilutions. A lot of photographers got severely
    >>> underdeveloped negs with those dilutions, using Kodak?s times. Turns 
out,
    >>> Xtol cannot stand being diluted that much unless you develop the 
film in a
    >>> much larger tank than you normally need. I think there had to be 
200ml of
    >>> stock in the diluted developer for each roll, so for 1+3 developing, 
you
    >>> could do only one roll in a 32ox tank that could hold four rolls!
    >>> 
    >>> Kodak published the minimum stock quantity needed but a lot of people
    >>> ignored it and complained, so they just stopped publishing the times 
for
    >>> the higher dilutions!
    >>> 
    >>> I actually have a copy in PDF format of the original Xtol info 
booklet,
    >>> but the times would be off for Kodak films now since Kodak 
reformulated
    >>> Tri-X and the Tmax films since then. They did publish times for 
Ilford
    >>> films, which might still work if you?re interested in seeing it.
    >>> 
    >>> -- 
    >>> Chris Crawford
    >>> Fine Art Photography
    >>> Fort Wayne, Indiana
    >>> 260-437-8990
    >>> 
    >>> http://www.chriscrawfordphoto.com  My portfolio
    >>> 
    >>> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Christopher-Crawford/48229272798
    >>> Become a fan on Facebook
    >>> 
    >>> 
    >>> 
    >>> On 6/15/17, 5:15 AM, "LUG on behalf of lluisripollphotography"
    >>> <lug-bounces+chris=chriscrawfordphoto.com at leica-users.org on 
behalf of
    >>> lluisripollphotography at gmail.com> wrote:
    >>> 
    >>>> I don?t have a large experience with Xtol, I?ve used for years 
ID11/D76.
    >>>> I?ve developed my two last films of Bergger Pancro 400 in Xtol 
Stock at
    >>>> the recomended time, but I?m unhappy with the results. I?ve used it 
in
    >>>> stock to get the shortest developing time and minimize the grain 
effect.
    >>>> 
    >>>> I would like hear your experiences with Xtol, I mainly use FP4 and 
HP5.
    >>>> 
    >>>> Thanks in advance
    >>>> 
    >>>> Lluis
    >>>> 
    >>>> 
    >>>> 
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    >>> 
    >>> 
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