Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2013/05/08
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]Anyone can take a look at the COMPLETE set of photos in the exhibit here: http://www.blakeandrewsphoto.com/winogrand.pdf The images are pretty small, but I have them in person, as did many others. On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 9:29 PM, Richard Man <richard at richardmanphoto.com>wrote: > Mark, did you read everything I write? I made an observation. Viewers of > his exhibit can judge for themselves about my observation, which once again > is "few photos in his exhibit have people of colors, and exactly one Asian > that we can find." I am not accusing him of anything. Anyone can confirm or > refute my observation. The exhibit is still open and you can purchase the > book for $50. > > May be it;s the curator and has billions of photos of African American in > his vast quantity of negatives, but this exhibit does not show it. > > You are making accusation, I am not. Please have some restrain that you > speak of. > > > > On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 9:10 PM, Mark Rabiner <mark at > rabinergroup.com>wrote: > >> Have you seen his Rolodex? >> Because it really appears you are accusing Garry Winogrand of racism. >> And you don't know much about him. >> The idea that he'd have any problem with having people of color in his >> frame >> is patently absurd. >> When one makes slights against a someone's personal integrity some >> restraint >> in in order. Even if that person is not a towering figure of a particular >> type. In this case a photographer who dedicated his life to capture the >> world around him and who did it with some success. >> Is this a controversy? >> Has anyone in the history of the world ever said anything about the color >> of >> the people the great Garry Winogrand photographed? OF COURSE NOT. >> >> >> On 5/8/13 11:59 PM, "Richard Man" <richard at richardmanphoto.com> wrote: >> >> > Mark, have you SEEN the exhibit? How can you tell anything from a >> contact >> > sheet JPG that is dark and muddy? >> > >> > Besides, you are the one making accusation, I am making an observation. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 8:26 PM, Mark Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com> >> wrote: >> > >> >> >> >> >> http://blog.ricecracker.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Winogrand-contact-she >> >> et-950x811.jpg >> >> Or >> >> http://tinyurl.com/c2ppuu3 >> >> >> >> A really tasteless personally integrity slight against one of our >> great >> >> photographers. One could look a the work of Diane Arbus and Lee >> Friedlander >> >> and count the non white faces and make cracks about them it would be >> just >> >> as >> >> crassly ridiculous. >> >> Did Winogrand avoid getting non white faces in his camera frame? Just >> what >> >> are you saying here? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 5/8/13 9:44 PM, "Richard Man" <richard at richardmanphoto.com> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Nope, THAT image is particularly controversial (whether he intends it >> or >> >>> not is another matter). And nope, I just google image his name, and >> other >> >>> than THAT one, I still do not see images of people of color. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 6:29 PM, Mark Rabiner <mark at >> >>> rabinergroup.com> >> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> I just Google contact sheeted Garry Winogrand . >> >>>> The every first pic which comes up involves people of color. >> >>>> and the 3rd and 5th shots So it seems to be a pattern here in which >> >> every >> >>>> other pix involves a person of color. >> >>>> It seems he was not ignoring them. Would seem to have no problem with >> >> other >> >>>> than white people during an era of the civil rights movement in which >> >> you'd >> >>>> have to be very blind to not be having a lot of empathy with that >> >> struggle >> >>>> and probably be a bit involved yourself.... >> >>>> A key shot which comes up often is this one: >> >>>> >> >> >> http://www.thephoblographer.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/winogrand.jpg >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> On 5/7/13 12:35 AM, "Richard Man" <richard at richardmanphoto.com> >> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>>> I will just let the observation stands - there's no Asian and few >> >> African >> >>>>> Americans in his vast collection of photos (that we know of). >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Whether it's a subject worth analyzing or not is another matter. >> >> Probably >> >>>>> not. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 9:31 PM, Lew Schwartz <lew1716 at gmail.com> >> >> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>>> Well, he certainly had a lot of skill, and what we see is the >> result >> >> of >> >>>> a >> >>>>>> lot of editing. We don't know for a fact who or what everything was >> >>>> that he >> >>>>>> actually photographed. Ok, ok; I know ... same difference ... move >> the >> >>>>>> argument over to what we actually see after edits. I don't >> understand >> >>>> the >> >>>>>> kind of bias you're hinting at. If someone shoots cowboy shows, >> which >> >> he >> >>>>>> did, would that make him biased against antique fairs? I also don't >> >>>> think >> >>>>>> of criticism as a form of acknowledgement or recognition. >> >>>>>> It's like "Criticize me!! That way I'll at least know you know I'm >> >>>>>> here." Good criticism is way more than this. Poor people and rich >> >>>> people >> >>>>>> don't go in for this sort of attention and neither do I, although >> I'm >> >>>>>> neither. >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> -Lew Schwartz >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 12:10 AM, Richard Man < >> >>>> richard at richardmanphoto.com >> >>>>>>> wrote: >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>>> Lew, may be it's a form of approval,... or may be it is a form of >> >> color >> >>>>>>> blindness. Come on, during the long period he photographed, from >> 40s >> >> to >> >>>>>>> 80s, there were no interesting, even people to be critical about, >> of >> >>>>>> other >> >>>>>>> races that he had met or seen? >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> We are not talking someone who takes 100 pictures or even 1000 >> >>>> pictures a >> >>>>>>> year. In that case, what do you expect type of thing. He takes 100 >> >>>>>> pictures >> >>>>>>> a day easily. If you roam the streets of LA, or NY etc. and take >> that >> >>>>>> many >> >>>>>>> pictures, it takes skills not to take pictures of people of >> colors or >> >>>>>>> Asians... >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 8:48 PM, Lew Schwartz <lew1716 at >> >>>>>>> gmail.com> >> >>>> wrote: >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> I'm not sure I entirely understand Richards remarks. Winogrand >> never >> >>>>>>>> represented himself to be a news photographer, although he >> >> undoubtedly >> >>>>>>> took >> >>>>>>>> assignments and was presented to the public under that rubric. >> I've >> >>>>>>> always >> >>>>>>>> thought of him as highly critical of the society he photographed. >> >> His >> >>>>>>>> omissions may be a form of approval. >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> -Lew Schwartz >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 11:35 PM, Phil Swango <pswango at att.net> >> >> wrote: >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Richard Man wrote: >> >>>>>>>>>> Winograd is not my favorite street artist, mainly because it's >> the >> >>>>>>> same >> >>>>>>>>>> type of photos he shot. For example, the periods he covered >> >>>>>> included >> >>>>>>>> the >> >>>>>>>>>> civil rights movement and of all the hundreds of photos in the >> >>>>>> show, >> >>>>>>>>> there >> >>>>>>>>>> are may be 3-4 photos where African American are present, and >> as >> >>>>>> far >> >>>>>>> as >> >>>>>>>>> we >> >>>>>>>>>> can tell, exactly one photo where there is an Asian present - >> and >> >>>>>>> only >> >>>>>>>>>> because she was pretty and had goofy hair. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> Interesting thoughts Richard. We just had a lecture in the >> local >> >>>>>>> museum >> >>>>>>>>> about race, representation and photography. There's also an >> >>>>>>> interesting >> >>>>>>>>> new book in which an AA female photographer shoots her white >> >> friends >> >>>>>>> and >> >>>>>>>>> muses on whether and how race may figure into reading the photo. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>> >> >> >> http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/22/some-of-her-best-friends-are-white/ >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> If the link doesn't work look up Myra Greene. The book is "My >> >> White >> >>>>>>>>> Friends." I've ordered it. >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> -- >> >>>>>>>>> Phil Swango >> >>>>>>>>> 307 Aliso Dr SE >> >>>>>>>>> Albuquerque, NM 87108 >> >>>>>>>>> 505-262-4085 >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>>>>>> Leica Users Group. >> >>>>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >> >> information >> >>>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>>>>> Leica Users Group. >> >>>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >> >> information >> >>>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> -- >> >>>>>>> // richard <http://www.richardmanphoto.com> >> >>>>>>> // http://facebook.com/richardmanphoto >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>>>> Leica Users Group. >> >>>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >> information >> >>>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>>>> Leica Users Group. >> >>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >> information >> >>>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> -- >> >>>> Mark William Rabiner >> >>>> Photography >> >>>> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/ >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> Leica Users Group. >> >>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Mark William Rabiner >> >> Photography >> >> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Leica Users Group. >> >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Mark William Rabiner >> Photography >> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/ >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Leica Users Group. >> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information >> > > > > -- > // richard <http://www.richardmanphoto.com> > // http://facebook.com/richardmanphoto > > -- // richard <http://www.richardmanphoto.com> // http://facebook.com/richardmanphoto