Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2013/10/18

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Subject: [Leica] IMG: Tina's "Tea Party" reunion propaganda photo
From: sonc.hegr at (Sonny Carter)
Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2013 22:51:12 -0500
References: <> <>

  Times have changed and so have I, but I've owned a Walther P38 (WWII)
and  a Walther PPKS (James Bond's pistol).  I rarely fired either of them,
almost always at our family farm.

I did not own them for protection; I truly was fascinated by the mechanics.

I traded one for the other, then sold the PPK when I needed to pay some

I now own three firearms; a shotgun, a 22 rifle and a 22 pistol.  I've not
seen any of them for several years, and the last time we used them was at
the range, (I think I posted those pix)

?I'm pretty ambivalent about the issue when it comes to small arms like I
own.  I really don't understand, and get aggressive when the machine is
very automatic  ?and has a clip with a multitude of bullets. I don't know
why anyone needs that, (surely not hunters).

On Fri, Oct 18, 2013 at 10:09 PM, Jayanand Govindaraj <jayanand at>wrote:

> Larry,
> I disagree with you completely. My view is simple - any "civilized"
> human being who feels the need to own a gun (or any weapon of minor
> mass destruction) to show his/her macho credentials, and get his self
> respect into order, is not civilized but a barbarian. Fine
> instruments, indeed, what a cop out! A Leica is a far simpler way of
> reaching the same goal...(-: Taught to shoot at ten years, and you
> consider it "normal" - even if you are just busy exterminating animals
> instead of human beings - this is just unbelievable to the vast
> majority of humans on Earth. Those "military types" are far more
> trained and responsible, as well as safer for everyone than than the
> general public with cupboards full of guns, mostly unlicensed.
> Tina's photo is brilliant, and to a person like me who is not used to
> guns at all, except in the hands of the police/armed forces, is spine
> chilling in the extreme.
> I know you will come back at me with some slanging comments on India,
> as you normally do, but what India is does not change the reality of
> what the USA is. Remember that.
> Cheers
> Jayanand
> On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 1:24 AM,  <lrzeitlin at> wrote:
> > Don't over react to guns. They are common in rural America. There are far
> > more guns in the US than there are Leicas, Nikon, Canons, and all other
> fine
> > cameras combined. The gun culture is alive and well not only in the south
> > but in the North West, the mid-Atlantic states and in New England. The
> next
> > time you take a drive on a cross country highway stop in at a Cabella's
> or a
> > Bass Pro sporting goods store. You will see enough guns on display to
> arm a
> > regiment and enough ammunition to stock a medium sized rebellion. Schools
> > are even closed during deer hunting season in much of Pennsylvania. A
> > successful hunt is the key to a well fed holiday season. New York City
> even
> > hosted the Bannerman warehouse until it moved up the Hudson to Pollopel
> > Island. Bannerman and family were merchants who bought up most of the
> > military surplus from the Civil War, the Spanish-American war and WW I.
> Most
> > of the world's rebellions until the outbreak of WW 2 used Bannerman
> supplied
> > weapons. My father even had a Sears Roebuck sized catalog of Bannerman's
> > arms available for resale.
> >
> > When I was a boy the country was much less urban than it is now. In rural
> > communities gun ownership was accepted as a fact of life. Most families
> > owned at least two guns, a shotgun for hunting and a 22 cal. rifle for
> the
> > kids to plink around with. Most high schools had rifle teams, usually
> > subsidized by the Army. Indeed an armed population was considered the
> key to
> > national defense. What enemy would attack a country with a well armed
> > citizenry? The NRA, rather than being dedicated to supporting the Second
> > Amendment, was an advocate of teaching marksmanship in schools.
> >
> > I currently own three guns, a shotgun, a rifle, and a handgun. My
> favorite
> > is a Browning semi-automatic 22 rifle, also John Browning's favorite
> gun. It
> > is beautiful, a true work of art. I bought it on sight 40 years ago. I
> > lusted after that gun more than I ever lusted after a Leica camera. It
> has
> > appreciated in price more than twenty times the price I paid.
> > <
> > 17873/>
> >
> > I was taught to shoot as a ten year old at a YMCA camp by a German doctor
> > who had served as in infantryman under the Kaiser during WW I. At one
> time I
> > was even capable of shooting a bullet through the center of a cigarette,
> end
> > on, at 50 ft. I shake too much now and my vision isn't what it used to
> be.
> >
> > The prevalence of arms has a low correlation with gun murder rates.
> Vermont
> > and New Hampshire are the U.S. states with the highest per capita gun
> > ownership, minimum regulatory requirements, and also the lowest rates of
> gun
> > homicides. What really disturbs me is traveling through Europe and the
> > Middle East and seeing all those young military types in airports and
> > wandering the streets with fully armed large magazine assault rifles
> slung
> > over their backs. How responsible are they? You guys who are appalled at
> > seeing weapons, think about that.
> >
> > Now about Tina's picture of a "Tea Party" family reunion. This may be a
> > minority opinion but I think it is a poorly composed, unsharp, snapshot
> of a
> > family at a dinner table with one person handing a gun to another. Just a
> > bad picture. Peter is right is stating that prudent gun handling
> practices
> > are being violated. The is no indication that it is a "Tea Party"
> meeting at
> > all. Even Tina's  original title on her web site does not identify it as
> > such. This picture is far below Tina's usual standard and I suspect was
> > titled and posted only to evoke comment. And you can see. It did.
> >
> > Larry Z
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Leica Users Group.
> > See for more information
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
> See for more information


Natchitoches, Louisiana
Oldest Permanent Settlement in the Louisiana Purchase


Replies: Reply from rgacpa at (Bob Adler) ([Leica] IMG: Tina's "Tea Party" reunion propaganda photo)
Reply from jayanand at (Jayanand Govindaraj) ([Leica] IMG: Tina's "Tea Party" reunion propaganda photo)
In reply to: Message from lrzeitlin at (lrzeitlin at ([Leica] IMG: Tina's "Tea Party" reunion propaganda photo)
Message from jayanand at (Jayanand Govindaraj) ([Leica] IMG: Tina's "Tea Party" reunion propaganda photo)