Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2002/04/21

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Subject: [Leica] Re: what we talk about when we talk about women
From: Ken Wilcox <klw.51@comcast.net>
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 08:17:34 -0400
References: <000201c1e909$013df660$6b38fea9@thunderbelly>

Nicely said, Kyle.

I may have missed something (I don't read everything here} but I 
don't recall seeing any postings about your photo that I would 
consider demeaning to Colleen. Quite to the contrary. Most of hat I 
read about the picture were very complimentary to you and/or your 
subject. I is a beautiful photo of a lovely young woman..

Some of the discussion that spun off the subject, while perhaps 
objectifying, was not, AFAIK, directed at Colleen. I am looking 
forward to receiving my print of this fine photograph.

Ken Wilcox


At 12:38 AM -0700 4/21/02, kyle cassidy wrote:
>  >Well said Photo Phreak ... on a subject that is
>>"taboo"... to a point that a woman's beauty, is
>>becoming politically incorrect to comment on.
>
>there's nothing wrong with commenting on a woman (or anyone's) physical
>attractiveness. it is the derisiveness of some of these comments which
>bothers me. when you say "wow, nice tits doll" you are not commenting on
>someone's beauty, you're deriding them.
>
>while i'm certainly guilty of objectification of my subjects -- and i don't
>think that's necessarily wrong -- i do respect them. they're human beings,
>they're my friends, and they've trusted me. it's a betrayal of that trust if
>they then become the victims of oafish commentary. like the photographs or
>dislike them, but realize what risks models take when they put themselves in
>front of our cameras, especially when we ask them to take off their clothes
>first; they're making themselves vulnerable because they trust us to make
>something beautiful or meaningful -- as photographers and (hopefully)
>artists we are influencing how people around us think and how they behave.
>this is an awesome responsibility. i hope that i do justice to my subjects
>when i represent them. there are enough girls out there every day getting
>run over by the modeling industry, who get talked into doing things they
>don't really want to do by unscrupulous people, i don't want to contribute
>to that.
>
>and please remember, this mailing list isn't ted and b.d. and me and marc
>and whoever sitting on your back porch drinking beer at 1:00 in the morning
>at a hunting lodge in the remote wilderness of wyoming, it's a worldwide
>forum with thousands of people listening and a searchable archive. whatever
>you think you may be saying to just a few other people is going into the
>mailboxes of many.
>
>i may not be serious about much, but i'm serious about how photographers
>treat their models. and if i've taken someone who trusted me with the image
>of their own self worth and opened them up to mockery, i've failed in that
>contract and i need to go back to photographing bugs.
>
>i would suggest that when commenting on someone's physical appearance, even
>when you think you are complementing them, (and by this i mean the royal
>"you," meaning "all of us") imagine someone else is saying it about your
>wife or daughter before you commit it to the public record. because that's
>who we're talking about -- we're talking about the way that we, as artists,
>are conditioning the world to look at all women.
>
>i happen to think that's a beautiful shot -- and were i to see colleen, i'd
>say "hey, you look great."
>
>just my .02
>
>kc
>
>
>
>
>
>
>--
>To unsubscribe, see http://mejac.palo-alto.ca.us/leica-users/unsub.html


- -- 
_____________________
Ken Wilcox
klw.51 at comcast.net
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In reply to: Message from "kyle cassidy" <kcassidy@asc.upenn.edu> ([Leica] what we talk about when we talk about women)