[Leica] City Lights for a kiss

Thu Mar 28 10:02:25 PDT 2024

Dear Lluis,

What a gorgeous photograph. You have captured both the subject and the 
early evening light very well.

I agree that it really is very difficult issue, to try and get the same 
quality of image in printing as you do from your camera, whether film or 
digital.

I often take a frame of film and try to render it as I "pre-imagined" it 
from a scan such as a .TIFF, but I rarely succeed :-( . Even in a 
digital darkroom with the many, many steps you can take and variations 
that you can make, getting there is close to impossible. You can get it 
close to your imagined image, but printing it is then another thing!

I actually find it very discouraging. So much so that even those that I 
might like to print often remain as digital images.

Peter

On 27/03/2024 23:41, Lluis Ripoll via LUG wrote:
> Hi Don,
> 
> Thank you for your response, I really would like have discussions like this one in person, by e-,ail and English is more difficult for me.
> 
> Some time ago  I read a book “Le tirage à mains nues” by the Master Guillaume Geneste and he explains that one of the first questions he askedto his customers was “at which time did you this picture?”, to estimate the light intensity. On my case my photo didn’t was on the night, it was on the evening when still it was a little day light, the copy has the ambirent light at the time I shoot it.
> 
> I know the effect of the copy when it is dry, I think remember that in the US it was a website called “Zone VI”, they recommended give about 10% more light on the copy to prevent the drying effect. My knowledge working with a monitor is limited and I don’t expend time calibrating it for a perfect reproduction, the monitor for me is equivalent to a contact sheet, my real work is in the darkroom, for me the important is the final wet copy. I have intended to represent this one with a similar atmosohere when I saw the image.
> 
> Cheers
> Lluis
>   
> 
>   
>> El 27 març 2024, a les 16:24, Don Dory via LUG <lug at leica-users.org> va escriure:
>>
>> Discussions like your comments regarding my comments are very helpful.  I
>> was aware of the extreme methods W. Eugene Smith utilized to create the
>> image he saw or imagined.  So for two reasons I extended my thoughts on
>> your image.  The first would be to explain how your image resonated
>> with another viewer: I saw it as a wonderful end to an evening of joy.  The
>> emphasis was on evening so the tones would probably be best somewhat
>> darker.  You as the creator have your own vision in mind and your own shade
>> palette that you envisioned.  Feedback lets you confirm or adjust your
>> vision so that viewers are seeing what you intend.
>>
>>  From my years in wet printing I know very well how good a print looks as it
>> comes out of the wash then dries down to a less satisfactory look if you
>> like radiant blacks.  I have been able to calibrate my monitors so that
>> they accurately reflect the image as printed by Holland photo on their
>> large format printers.
>>
>> As an aside, I seem to recall that some of his negatives were lost/damaged
>> and he had to resort to photographing an acceptable print and working from
>> that negative.  Still a master.
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 26, 2024 at 4:30 PM Lluis Ripoll via LUG <lug at leica-users.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Don,
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for looking and your comments. I find very interesting
>>> your comment to start a good fiscussion (if I have the time :-). Every one
>>> of us we have our preferences, on my case I prefer the wode range of grey
>>> tones, however when it’s make a wet copy the tones are better represented
>>> than in a monitor, maybe I will burn a little bit the background area to
>>> enhance the couple, but in my opinion printing techniques will be not
>>> exactly as the dark tones that the Genious and Master Eugene Smith does, it
>>> depends more of the exposure and development than the printing techniques,
>>> if you want dark the tones using only printing techniques the highlights
>>> will probably look as grey tones instead a brilliant white. Smith had a
>>> very special technique, as you know normally the developersdilutions are
>>> 1:2 or 1:3, he did 2:1 !!!, he place the exposure one zone minus and
>>> develop for one zone more, for this reason his pictures show these rich
>>> dark tones and brilliant highlights, he say that he used usually the
>>> Farmers reductor to obtain better highlights, in the famous funeral photo
>>> he worked all the faces like this. His darkroom work was extraordinary, the
>>> Dr. Schweizer picture he took 5 days and 5 nights to do it, it had about
>>> 125 steps, finally he did a picture of the final print and he reduced the
>>> steps to 25 and he was very happy!
>>>
>>> All this and other techniques from Masters as Emmet Gowin I had the
>>> privilege to see his originals, are explained on te two book of the
>>> Editorial Lustrum, founded in 1973 by Ralph Gibson, these two books
>>> contents interviews with many Masters explaining their techniques, I really
>>> recommend them for the darkroom lovers.
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> Lluis
>>>
>>>
>>>> El 26 març 2024, a les 13:55, Don Dory via LUG <lug at leica-users.org> va
>>> escriure:
>>>>
>>>> Great capture, I think that printed a little darker to influence the
>>> seeing
>>>> as evening culmination of a great date.  Just my initial thoughts of a
>>>> wonderful image.  Plus I've been examining the non dog images of Elliot
>>>> Erwitt which have been printed to the dark side.  That and the images of
>>>> Eugene Smith especially his loft project so my exposure has been to the
>>>> dark side of prints.
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Mar 26, 2024 at 6:41 AM Lluis Ripoll via LUG <
>>> lug at leica-users.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> <http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/luisrq/Barcelona/2024F030330.jpg.html
>>>>
>>>>> Leica M6, Summilux 50 II, Tri-X 400, D-23 Stock
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for looking, your c&c are welcome
>>>>>
>>>>> Saludos cordiales
>>>>> Lluis
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Don
>>>> don.dory at gmail.com
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Leica Users Group.
>>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Leica Users Group.
>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Don
>> don.dory at gmail.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Leica Users Group.
>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information

-- 

Dr. Peter Dzwig