Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2015/05/15
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]I've been cranking out digital files since 2003 that's 12 years and have not lost any files than I can think of. Maybe one image came up wonky once in my first year from a Digilux 1 which shot jpgs or Tiffs when I was clueless with my digital workflow using the software they gave me in the box with the camera. (Leica). I've never accidently deleted a week or months worth of files or anything significant or traumatic but the way I handed my first shots degraded them as they were re jpeged every time you switched their orientation from portrait to landscape. So those shots are really not so usable right now. User error though really.. You see that mentioned as problem with digital archiving. People accidently deleting stuff. People could accidently start their print file room on fire there is no remedy for sheer stuipidity. On the LUG if anyone had a traumatic digital loss no one is talking about it. Part of that might be just embarrassment for not having backed it up. By the way putting your pix offsite on some cloud doesn't count when the company of course at one point decides it bored with the business as of course that is what is going to happen. If you valued your work you'd have it sitting next you you at your desk. But I can tell you one thing I know is true and is a reality when working with film as I've done most of my life my own darkroom when I was 14 in 1965. Every roll of film or print we ever made is fading right this very moment as we speak. Last year those pictures were in better shape. Next year they'll be in worse shape. Rinse and repeat till infinity. - next year when I access a digital file it took today or last month year or decade its going to pop up good as new. Not 99% but 100%. That's all I know from a dozen years shooting digital and from common sense and from everyone else I've ever asked or met. And the image I make from that file with Photoshop having progressed and my talent with it having progressed and printers having progressed and galleries on the internet having progressed is going to be a far better experience and result. The bottom line is the area of archivalness is a plus for the digital not a minus. Its a reason to love digital not be a dinosaur and shoot film. If you value your pictures and your work shoot digital not film. Not the reverse. People will take any fawning aspect of film they can and make it a plus over digital when most of them are a minus. Film is in most almost all ways an inferior process over digital photography. I have not embarrassments or qualms about taking my digital camera out tonight and shooting pix I'd never get in a million years shooting film. I have my digital files right here I'm looking at them sitting on my desk in WD hard disks. Backups are in the bottom space of this desk they are older WD hard disks. Smaller ones as I go back in time. My film and prints and contracts and model releases are in a storage cubical in Portland and I hope they are ok and the conditions keeping them are not so bad. 2,895 miles away. Some day or year I'll be able to bring more stuff back to NY but had I shot it all in digital since day one I'd be in far far better shape than I am now. By the way the day I finished college and started out in photography just about coincides with the first digital picture ever taken. And that was early December 1975. I remember reading it in the newspaper thinking "I bet those pictures don't look very good yet". And decided to stay with my Nikons for the time being and pray for a Hasselblad. On 5/15/15 2:28 AM, "Nathan Wajsman" <nwajsman at gmail.com> wrote: > Frank, the HD that crashed (as did mine last month) was in use every day. > My > backup disk is in use only when I am actually writing to it (and when I > retrieved the backed-up images onto the repaired HD). Most of the time it > is > just sitting there, not plugged into anything. You cannot compare the two > sitations. Refreshing the backups more than once a year might be good for my > local Media Markt but it would be a waste of time and money for > me. Cheers, Nathan Nathan Wajsman Alicante, > Spain http://www.frozenlight.eu http://www.greatpix.eu PICTURE OF THE WEEK: > http://www.fotocycle.dk/paws Blog: > http://nathansmusings.wordpress.com/ Cycling: > http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/belgiangator YNWA > On 15 May > 2015, at 07:41, Frank Filippone <red735i at verizon.net> wrote: > > I guess you > cannot be convinced with technical facts. > > Try this out.... How many HDD > crash without warning? Richard Man's crashed > last week. You think HIS > files are intact any more on that disk? > > Even if you do not believe us > about magnetic bits going wonky, do backups > anyway. And refresh them at > least once a year... or more often. You may do > it for the wrong reason, but > at least you are doing it...... > > Frank Filippone > Red735i at verizon.net > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: LUG > [mailto:lug-bounces+red735i=verizon.net at leica-users.org] On Behalf > Of Mark > Rabiner > Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2015 10:32 PM > To: Leica Users Group > > Subject: [Leica] (SPAM: ?) Re: So much for "film is forever".. > Importance: > Low > > I have been Binging and Googling "photography old digital files > corrupted" > and you'd think one person in the world in the last 15 years of > digital > photography must have expensed it especially since we're being told > not that > digital media only lasts ten years tops. I'm coming up with Jack on > this the > only thing I seem to find is when peoples memory cards give out on > them > there is recovering software to bring some of those images back. > > Nothing not one thing on pictures on a hard disk no longer openable or > > looking wonky. > I'm back to feeling much more at ease in the state of my > digital body of > work. > > > On 5/15/15 1:21 AM, "Mark Rabiner" > <mark at rabinergroup.com> wrote: > >> I think the fact that while most of us > have switched to digital our >> body of work is now (roughly since the year > 2000) is in danger is very >> on topic as I think its big news where can I > sell my digital bodies >> and re buy back my film ones?!? >> >> I'd like to > hear a roll count on the LUG of people whose old digital >> files have given > up on them or have gotten all wonky. Other side known >> as digital > fading. >> I'm being told by you that my digital files are deteriorating I > JUST >> CAN SEE IT.!! >> >> I don't think when you back up digitally to do > it redundantly is the >> end of the world. I used to back up my whole hard > disk with floppies. >> A stack of them many inches thick. And I had several > sets of them in >> case one of them was bad and for other reasons. It was an > automatic > process but doable. >> Now its just copying one hard disk to > another sometimes a slightly bigger > one. >> Can be done in ones sleep. >> > >> >> On 5/14/15 7:16 PM, "Spencer Cheng" <spencer at aotera.org> wrote: >> > >>> We are going way off topic here so this is my last comment. I did not > >>> say to store your digital media using microfiche. >>> >>> I am aware of > a group of digital archivist (including someone from >>> NIST) working on how > to preserve digital media in a standardized fashion. >>> >>> Best practice > digital media preservation currently require regular >>> active copying and > indefinite transcription of digital media to >>> protect again deterioration > of storage media and format obsolescence. >>> >>> If you are not doing both, > your stored media is likely to stay >>> ephemeral despite of what you > believe. >>> >>> Mark, do as you wish but 1?s magically becomes 0?s in > digital media >>> whether you believe it?s going to happen or not. Good > Luck. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Spencer >>> >>>> On May 14, 2015, at 16:17, Mark > Rabiner <mark at rabinergroup.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> From the Library of Congress > (USA) >>>> "Does the Library of Congress recommend microfilming or > digitization >>>> for reformatting institutional collections?.... >>>> >>>> > " That said, the end of microfilming is near, despite it's >>>> relatively > low cost and the several hundred year projected lifetime of > preservation > film. >>>> The National Endowment for the Humanities no longer funds grants > for >>>> microfilming and microfilm readers are increasingly difficult to > >>>> maintain and service." >>>> >>>> > http://www.loc.gov/preservation/about/faqs/reformatting.html#prescop >>>> > y >>>> >>>> Recognizing Digitization as a Preservation Reformatting Method > >>>> http://chnm.gmu.edu/digitalhistory/links/pdf/preserving/8_34a.pdf >>>> > >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 5/14/15 1:17 AM, "Spencer Cheng" > <spencer at aotera.org> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Canadian Archive uses microfiche which > are stable for 100+ years >>>>> (or acid-free paper for documents). The > Canadian census was stored >>>>> that way. ?was? because >>> I am not sure we > have a real census any >>>>> more. >>>> >>>> Digital storage is very >>>>> > ephemeral. I doubt if most digital storage will last more than 10 > > years. >>>>> Those >>>>> 1?s randomly change to 0?s far too frequently. I > don?t think >>>>> archivist like digital media very much. >>>>> >>>> >>>> > Regards, >>>> Spencer >>>> >>>> >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> Leica >>>>> Users > Group. >>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more >>>>> > information >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Mark William Rabiner >>>> > Photographer >>>> http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/ >>>> >>>> >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Leica Users > Group. >>>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more > information >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> > Leica Users Group. >>> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for > more information >> >> >> > > > > > -- > Mark William Rabiner > > Photographer > http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See > http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See > http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > _______________________________________________ Leica Users Group. See > http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information -- Mark William Rabiner Photographer http://gallery.leica-users.org/v/lugalrabs/