Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2007/02/14

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Subject: [Leica] Google
From: abridge at gmail.com (Adam Bridge)
Date: Wed Feb 14 16:57:42 2007
References: <1be504db0702140736t39e3b813vdbbe7d18e3602c9b@mail.gmail.com> <4cfa589b0702140944v7ce7566fn528af40885eaed08@mail.gmail.com> <45D35DF4.2020107@nathanfoto.com> <5E8A7CC846DF425B6E845A8D@dhcp-wi-45.sql1.isc.org> <6e74b3700702141140m6be4dfb2m807ecff69d1f3ef8@mail.gmail.com> <B57D710EA73C5A5644F221C1@dhcp-wi-45.sql1.isc.org> <6e74b3700702141148p2cbad504qe37d48dee2f62b69@mail.gmail.com> <6FA591A83B8F39609B39080C@scarborough.isc.org> <6e74b3700702141210s5f8db8a7m19ceb40a11dacad2@mail.gmail.com>

This is true for any e-mail system of any kind unless you use
hard-core encryption. There's always SOMEONE who can poke through the
e-mail files on the server if they want to badly enough.

The real question is: Does Google mine your e-mail for personal data
or allow others to do so?

If you believe the answer to that question is "yes" then you shouldn't
use it nor should you send any mail TO an account on gmail that might
in any way be sensitive unless it's thorough encrypted. There are some
good encryption products out there Pretty Good Privacy would seem a
fine candidate and it's probably legal where you live.

I, personally, do not believe that Google is going to sell my name /
identity / e-mail address to someone based on mining my e-mail. They
DO create ads - on the fly - based on the content of e-mail messages
that flow to my computer. I do not mind this so I use gmail for my
mailing list traffic.

Private traffic, professional traffic, those go through other e-mail systems.

Strangely, I find few systems that work as well as gmail and NONE that
search the archives as well as gmail. I'm not particularly good at
constructing key-word searches (my wife is fantastic but she's a
mathematician with a library minor so no surprise THERE) but I can
often find stuff in the couple years of LUG archives that gmail now
holds.

Whether Google was right or wrong to "steal" IP from newspapers by
making them 1) easy to find and 2) easy to get to is a different
issue. Personally I think the newspapers in question are still waiting
to report for certain that the Germans have invaded, falling bombs to
the contrary. In a lot of places, some of them directly involved with
IP law, they are sort of a laughing stock -- the worst of "old world"
ideas.

We'll see. I believe that Google is, still, trying to flush away their
cache entries for everything related to those newspapers -- a
non-trivial evolution given the speed-but-not-storage efficient
methodology Google uses. Things could REALLY get ugly if the papers
start to demand that the data be removed from backed-up data.
Shuddering just to IMAGINE that.

I certainly can understand Brian's feelings about Google given his
up-close-and-personal experiences with them. "Do no evil" indeed! And
his treatment, along with Google's dealings with China, are not
shining examples of its corporate culture.

But I believe they are tending to behave fairly well. Certainly they
do their job well. Like all ascendant entities in the world's pop
culture they are coming under attack simply because they are large and
successful. I note that Apple now is experiencing this phenomena as
well.

Adam

On 2/14/07, Simon Ogilvie <simon.ogilvie@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 14/02/07, Brian Reid <reid@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us> wrote:
>
> >
> > gmail is a high quality product that does what it does very well. It may
> > well be the best email system out there.
> >
>
> I agree, but if Nathan is correct then anything I send using gmail is
> "available" for Google to use as they wish.  I suppose that's going to be
> true for any web-based email system where the mail is stored on third-party
> computer systems.  To that end, I'd be happier using the LUG gallery than
> Picassa web gallery as at least we know the owner of the computer :-)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Leica Users Group.
> See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information
>

In reply to: Message from pswango at att.net (Phil Swango) ([Leica] A few photos)
Message from abridge at gmail.com (Adam Bridge) ([Leica] A few photos)
Message from nathan at nathanfoto.com (Nathan Wajsman) ([Leica] Google)
Message from reid at mejac.palo-alto.ca.us (Brian Reid) ([Leica] Google)
Message from simon.ogilvie at gmail.com (Simon Ogilvie) ([Leica] Google)
Message from reid at mejac.palo-alto.ca.us (Brian Reid) ([Leica] Google)
Message from simon.ogilvie at gmail.com (Simon Ogilvie) ([Leica] Google)
Message from reid at mejac.palo-alto.ca.us (Brian Reid) ([Leica] Google)
Message from simon.ogilvie at gmail.com (Simon Ogilvie) ([Leica] Google)