Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2004/07/13
[Author Prev] [Author Next] [Thread Prev] [Thread Next] [Author Index] [Topic Index] [Home] [Search]But Kimi did MORE OK... his drive was awesome! Will he ever beat the Ferrari juggernaut? Will Kimi take a picture of Schumi with his M7 as he passes him? Len -- -----Original Message----- From: lug-bounces+ljkapner=cox.net@leica-users.org [mailto:lug-bounces+ljkapner=cox.net@leica-users.org] On Behalf Of Tim Atherton Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 2:29 PM To: Leica Users Group Subject: RE: [Leica] Re: Digital M BD > and a Formula 1 > (World Championship) car about $25,000,000. That's what Frank does for a "living".... :-) Not 100% sure - I think this is Frank in all his glory (?): http://bmw.williamsf1.com/ms/images/de/4_serien/41_f1/414_highlights/4141_bi ldergalerie/16_frankreich/16_frankreich_07.jpg http://bmw.williamsf1.com/ms/images/de/4_serien/41_f1/414_highlights/4141_bi ldergalerie/14_usa/14_usa_08.jpg Frank - hey Montoya did okay last week > -----Original Message----- > From: lug-bounces+tim=kairosphoto.com@leica-users.org > [mailto:lug-bounces+tim=kairosphoto.com@leica-users.org]On Behalf Of > Frank Dernie > Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 1:44 PM > To: Leica Users Group > Subject: Re: [Leica] Re: Digital M > > > BD, > I am an engineer with a reasonable knowledge of manufacturing processes > and costs. The main reason for the high cost of Leica items is that > their market is so small. Canon can recover the design and tooling > costs of a lens over probably hundreds more units than Leica can. > To put this in perspective a good quality road car production cost is > about $4000, a Champ car (Indy car) about $400,000 and a Formula 1 > (World Championship) car about $25,000,000. There is a considerable > technological difference but the main reasons for these vast difference > in costs are the quantity of units over which engineering and tooling > costs are amortised. > Leica lenses are sold in too few numbers to be inexpensive without > bankrupting the company. And you have to pay a premium for the brand, > like cars :-) > Frank > > > On 13 Jul, 2004, at 19:39, B. D. Colen wrote: > > > There is no question that the M and Rs are extremely well built - the > > Ms > > are probably the best built modern cameras. And the lenses have no > > peers > > in terms of build quality. However...Is the build quality of an MP five > > times better than that of a Bessa R2? I don't think so. Much better? > > Absolutely! Twice as good? Not a doubt. Three times as good? Probably? > > But five times better? I seriously doubt it - and yet the MP is five > > times the price. Is the build quality of the old Summilux 50 almost > > five > > times better than that of the Cosina Nokton 50 1.5? No chance in hell. > > Twice as good? Even that's a stretch, but I'll grant that. Image > > quality? It's pretty much a dead heat. Yet the Summilux cost almost > > five > > times as much. Why? The red dot. > > > > Is the DigiII 33 % better built, or does it produce 33% better images > > than the Panasonic version of the same camera? How could it possibly - > > it's the same damn camera but black and without a red dot. > > > > Leica equipment is stellar - but please don't tell me you're not paying > > a huge premium for the name and red dot. :-) > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: lug-bounces+bdcolen=earthlink.net@leica-users.org > > [mailto:lug-bounces+bdcolen=earthlink.net@leica-users.org] On Behalf Of > > Peterson Arthur G NSSC > > Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 12:13 PM > > To: 'Leica Users Group' > > Subject: RE: [Leica] Re: Digital M > > > > > > > > I do not think the prices of Leica cameras and lenses are not > > "reasonable." They are built like no others, and the prices are > > "reasonable" for what you get. You can buy many Toyotas, or even > > several very fine Mercedes Benzes, for the price of a single > > Rolls-Royce. > > > > Art Peterson > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Felix Lopez de Maturana [mailto:fmaturana@euskalnet.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2004 11:51 > > To: lug@leica-users.org > > Subject: [Leica] Re: Digital M > > > > > >> I don't know that I call fine-tuning lenses innovative, David. Yes, > >> they produce stunning lenses; absolutely no question about it. But the > >> reality is that Canon also produces some stunning lenses, and even > >> Nikon produces a few. ;-) There's nothing really "innovative" about > >> it. > > > >> Now, if they found a way to produce stunning lenses at far lower cost, > >> that would be innovative. ;-) > > > > May be the problem of Leica is that, probably due to the size and > > management of the company, Leica cannot achieve the production of > > stunning lenses not at a lower cost, this may be mathematically > > impossible, but at a reasonable price. A "standard" lens like the new > > 50mm ASPH is merely out of reason at the price is offered. I can buy > > two > > excellent Canon L lenses for this price. Probably a problem of efficacy > > of the company that will disappear if this situation remains. > > > > Felix > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Leica Users Group. > > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > _______________________________________________ > > Leica Users Group. > > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Leica Users Group. > > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > > > > _______________________________________________ > Leica Users Group. > See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information > _______________________________________________ Leica Users Group. See http://leica-users.org/mailman/listinfo/lug for more information