RE: [Leica] Bokeh is nonsense!!!

["Austin Franklin" <darkroom@ix.netcom.com>]

Gary,

> And the converse:
> just because you use it, doesn't mean that it will enhance the images
> of other by the use of it.

But Gary, I said exactly that too...

> >Your comment is what is utter nonsense, and arrogantly demeaning.
> No more of a nonsense than worrying about the shape and quality of out
> of focus areas of a photograph. No more arrogant than saying that
> since some photographers use it, that it is therefore "viable" for
> everyone.

Well I NEVER said that bokeh WAS "viable for EVERYONE".  And since I didn't
say what you believe I said, now is my claiming "bokeh IS viable" arrogant?
It's just a statement of fact.  Of course, it is not viable for EVERYONE,
I've said that many times...if you read my posts.

How is ME being concerned with bokeh in MY images is somehow nonsense?
That's really absurd.

Really, Gary, my comment was entirely on the mark with respect to what I was
responding to (which you clipped).  Yours is just really off base.

> >Bokeh DOES exist and IS a viable technique.
>
> Ultimately this IS the point. For Ted and me and others it doesn't
> exist and isn't a "viable" technique. For You it is.

Because YOU don't shoot "FOR" it doesn't mean it doesn't exist, and whether
YOU use it or not, or whether it IS "for you" or not, it IS a viable
technique.  Because you're not conscious of the coating on your lense (and
shoot "for" it), does that mean the effects from it don't exist?  Does DOF
exist?  Is DOF a viable technique?  Is developing B&W at diluted solutions a
"viable technique" to reducing grain?  All "viable" means is "capable of
effectiveness".

> discuss
> it as it relates and/or doesn't to our work.

Er, that's exactly what I did discuss...I even provided an example of MY
work to support why I use it.  Seems to me you really haven't read what I've
written...

> Bokeh does exist as it defines a real entity- out of focus areas of a
> photo.

But you just said above, and I quote "...for...me...it doesn't exist..."...

> But for me, all of the articles and discussions (on this list
> and others) all come down to a "subjective" judgement as to whether it
> is good or bad/ useful or a waste of time.

Of course...I believe everyone (who "believes" bokeh exists etc. that
is...which is kind of funny in and of it self...kind of like believing in
UFOs...of course UFOs exist...by definition, they exist) understands that.

> 			yours waiting to be convinced,

I have no interest in "convincing" you of much of anything (except that you
don't read what I write), I'll leave that to some more "existing" and
"viable" people in the group ;-)

Austin

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