Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2001/10/02

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Subject: Re: [Leica] Re: Xtol newbie
From: "Guna Sengalrayan" <gunas@consortio.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 12:46:37 +0800
References: <200110021852.OAA20959@tigercat.nyfir.pwj.com>

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Rei Shinozuka" <shino@ubspainewebber.com>
To: <leica-users@mejac.palo-alto.ca.us>
Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2001 2:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Leica] Re: Xtol newbie


>> From: Guy Bennett <gbennett@lainet.com>
>>
>> According to Anchell and Troop, "dilution increases speed and sharpness
>> with XTOL. Dilutions of 1:3 or more are frequently recommended. At these
>> dilutions XTOL is effectively a nonsolvent developer, but because of its
>> careful buffering, grain is still fine." (Film Developing Cookbook, p.
50)
>>
>> So with XTOL in dilutions of at least 1:3, you get both the fine grain of
a
>> solvent developer *and* the sharpness of a non-solvent developer,
something
>> that has been remarked by a number of folks on this list. And as for not
>> having enough developer at dilutions greater than 1:1, I don't believe
it.


>i guess you are referring to the kodak-recommended "100 ml rule":
>
>From Kodak J109:
>
>   We recommend always starting with at least 100 mL (3.5 fluidounces) of
>   full-strength developer to prepare the diluted solution for each 135-36
or
>   120 roll (or the equivalent of 80 square inches [516 square
centimetres]).
>
>in practical terms, this would imply that with a dilution of 1+3, you would
>need 100x4=400ml of diluted solution per roll.  this is roughly equivalent
>to one reel in a 2-reel (16 oz) tank full of 1+3 XTOL.
>
>
>
>> While there is much to be said for following manufacturers' instructions,
>> personal experience suggests that it is simply not true. (Like having to
>> mix XTOL at 20° when other temps will also work.) Why not try it yourself
>> and compare?
>>
>> Guy


>i do often break the 100ml rule.  does the 100ml rule have safety factors
>built-in, like making sure it will work with 1-year-old developer made
>with rusty tapwater, developing muddy-dense negatives, etc?  with fresh
xtol
>made with distilled water, can we get down to 70-75 ml per roll?

>do others break the 100 ml rule?

>-rei



I have broken the 100 ml rule with TriX and TMax100 and the results are
fine. Xtol dilution was 1:3. Actual developer amount was 65ml : 195ml which
gave a total of 260ml of solution.

I tried this on Neopan 400 but had inconsistent results. On certain
occassions the roll came out thin.

Processing was done using a CPE2+ at 25 deg C.

Jobo's website has an article about this and they had similar findings using
Neopan when less than 100ml of stock was used.

I would like to hear from others who has tried Neopan 400 using less than
100ml of Xtol stock at 1:3.

- -guna



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In reply to: Message from Rei Shinozuka <shino@ubspainewebber.com> (Re: [Leica] Re: Xtol newbie)