Archived posting to the Leica Users Group, 2003/03/08

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Subject: Re: [Leica] Flag waving
From: Jerry Lehrer <jerryleh@pacbell.net>
Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 15:08:16 -0800
References: <002001c2e4fc$14104fa0$83314f51@desktop> <3E695EF3.E38B8E74@pacbell.net> <3.0.2.32.20030308142745.01c5ec68@roanoke.infi.net> <3E6A4C2C.B4D8FBE8@pacbell.net> <002d01c2e5b2$93c202a0$d1824d51@desktop> <3.0.2.32.20030308181745.016d1214@roanoke.infi.net>

Murray

I do not purport or pretend to be in any way a Scot except
what has rubbed off in contact with my wife or with Lagavulin.

Come to think of it, I have had more contact lately with
Lagavulin than with my wife :-)

BTW, there never was a "Clan Lehrer" in Kiel.

Jerry

Marc James Small wrote:

> At 12:58 PM 3/8/03 -0800, Jerry Lehrer wrote:
> >
> >When we last visited Scotland and made a search of the Rutherford
> >clan genealogy, we found out that the Rutherfords were border
> >reivers, who pillaged the English near the border.
> >
> >My wife's mother was a MacDonald, and they had a different
> >reputation. Bloodier yet, I believe.
> >
> >BTW, are we supposed to consider Marc the Small, as an arbiter
> >of who are the real Scots?  I'll wager that he can't drink Laphroig.:-)
>
> Sorry, Jerry, but the Smalls are merely a minor sept (attendant family) of
> Clan Murray.  Two of my uncles died at Culloden, fighting under Lord George
> Murray for the King Over The Water.  They wouldn't let their baby brother
> come along, and it is him from whom I am descended.
>
> I haven't my Scots literature at hand so I cannot discuss your putative
> "Clan" Rutherford, but a group which were Border reivers were not
> Highlanders.  See, inter multa alia, George MacDonald Fraser's book on the
> borders for a rather explicit discussion of the difference.  Some of these
> reiver families were nasty enough to scare the Brits, though the
> Highlanders kept them in line.  We have a number of Rutherfords and
> Rutherfoords locally, but they claim descent from the Highlands.
>
> Don't fall for the grand commercialization of being either Scots or Irish,
> Jerry.  Put some effort into the study and you can learn much but merely
> buying a plaque with the "family crest" and a mimeographed history doesn't
> cut it.  And, certainly, do NOT invest in a "Clan Lehrer" kilt, both as
> you'd probably not be able to wear it properly ("you have to swing your
> hips like a cheap whore",  a retired Sergeant out of the Gordons once told
> me) and because there isn't a "Clan Lehrer" --  but, to make a buck, the
> wool merchants will quickly concoct such and swear by their mother's blood
> that it is true and accurate.  If you'll come and spend a weekend in my
> delightful home, however, I will share with you the design of the Blue
> Ridge Highlands tartan and you certainly can wear that.
>
> Wearing a tartan is as decisive an act as putting a political bumper
> sticker on a car -- and floral decorations count for as much or more among
> the knowledgeable.  If I showed up in a Royal Stewart, I would be a cad.
> If I showed up in a Campbell sett, the current Duke of Argyll, if he heard
> of it, would be shocked.  If I wore a Fraser tartan, it would be (and is)
> viewed as a fine respect for my paternal grandmother's family.  (Jerry, do
> you recall that Gary Cooper/Paulette Goddard vehicle, THE UNCONQUERED
> (1947)?  The characther played by Ward Bond therein is an historical
> figure, one John Fraser -- and he is my fourth-great-grandfather.)
>
> Learn the turf.  Our Clan Chief recently died, and I know not the new
> fellow, but the late Duke of Atholl welcomed all who came into the Clan.  I
> suspect that you'd look fine in a green Murray tartan, and I'd be glad to
> take you to the Santa Rosa Games which are still, I believe, the largest in
> the nation.  My father ran the Murray tent there for some years, a
> quarter-century and more back.
>
> Beannacht leibh,
>
> Marc
>
> msmall@infi.net  FAX:  +276/343-7315
> Cha robh bąs fir gun ghrąs fir!
>
> --
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In reply to: Message from "GeeBee" <graham@geebeespaw.freeserve.co.uk> ([Leica] Flag waving)
Message from Jerry Lehrer <jerryleh@pacbell.net> (Re: [Leica] Flag waving)
Message from Marc James Small <msmall@infi.net> (Re: [Leica] Flag waving)
Message from Jerry Lehrer <jerryleh@pacbell.net> (Re: [Leica] Flag waving)
Message from "GeeBee" <graham@geebeespaw.freeserve.co.uk> (Re: [Leica] Flag waving)
Message from Marc James Small <msmall@infi.net> (Re: [Leica] Flag waving)